Who's the Traitor (possible spoilers for current issue)

[nerd4hire]

So, in 8.09 we learned there's an "inside man". In 8.10 we learned betrayal and treachery is coming.

So who is the treasonous, traitor, on the inside and why would he or she turn?

There's some interesting possibilities.

Kennedy? She doesn't like magic. Twilight wants to rid the world of magic. Her family is wealthy. that would give her connections. I don't see it myself. The traitor is inside the central chain of command. He or she knew Buffy survived her confrontation with Gigi.

Xander? All I can think of is reasons why it couldn't possibly be. Surely not loyal Xander. Then again perhaps the fact he's least likely makes him most suspicious. But why would he turn. Surely he's not still pissed about that eye thing... Ya know though, he is the only one who is still on good terms with Buffy. He's the only one who is still truly on the inside.

Dawn? This possibility makes me think of something. Perhaps the traitor is enchanted.

Willow? Willow has secrets, and dark feelings concerning Buffy. But why would she want to rid the world of magic?

Giles? There's the possibility of hidden motives. Possibly something to do with his watcher connection. Buffy and Giles are on the outs though, and wouldn't the inside man want to stay inside?

Faith? Nah. She was never really "inside". Wouldn't it be sweet irony if by the end of the story Buffy discovers the only one she can trust is Faith? :drunk:

A Slayer, or Slayer Witch? I don't know. Maybe.

Andrew? He's my prime suspect. Twilight wears the same jacket Spike and Andrew have. Spike isn't around. Andrew can't be trusted. He's weak around evil. Warren can influence him. Warren's still around. The twilight's plan is to separate Buffy from her support group. Andrew pushed Spike and Angel away by setting up the Buffy decoy with the Immortal.

Somebody else? Who else is there on, or near the inside?

[Buffy obsessed fan]

I think it'll be Kennedy or Andrew. I agree with your Andrew reasonings, not sure if I'm just sayin' Kennedy because of my self loathing toward her, or what, but there is the whole she came back from a mystical death thing, and she really doesn't like magicks, I have some suspicion toward her.

[Allycat]

Andrew makes the most sense from almost every angle. Except maybe that Robin said "the closest" about the betrayal, which in my mind can only mean Xander. And since I'm hoping for Bander/Xuffy (what's the official name?) action this season, I decided not to vote for him ;) Ignoring something always makes it go away, right?

[alexa]

Xander makes the most sense to me because of the whole 'closest and unexpected' - because he is.
But he's so unexpected and close, and also maybe too obvious that I went with someone else.
It's just a thought but they're making a bigger deal then usual about how everyone in the chain is connected.. and we see this again in the preview for #11. I'm thinking Buffy would be really crushed if she's betrayed by just about every other slayer there is.. they might turn on her for some reason maybe.
Oh and I'm also wanting some 'Bander' ;)

[nerd4hire]

Hehe, I just thought of something. Renee/Xander is Rander. Too bad his name wasn't Xandier.

[white avenger]

My vote is por Xander simply because Joss seems to take great pleasure in doing things in his stories just to make the viewers/readers scream, "NOOOOO!" and just too many people love and adore Xander for there NOT to be that sort of reaction if he turns out to be the betrayer.

[sosa lola]

About it being Xander, a member in another forum posted this interesting plotline where Xander is the betrayer.

"It's the last but two issue of Season 8. Twilight's plan to end all magic and banish all demons from the world is in full swing... but Buffy and Willow have decided they can't face that, and have developed a plan to prevent it happening. Their magic ritual involves a red glowing egg which will absorb and defeat Twilight's own demon-banishing spell.

But Xander is conflicted about the whole thing. He's loyal to his friends, of course he is. But he can't help thinking that a world without vampires, or demons, or warlocks, would be a good thing for the vast majority of humanity. And in long sleepless nights, he gradually decides that Buffy and Willow are being selfish: they're trying to cling to the things that make them special and superior to normal humans, at the expense of the general good.

And so at the last minute he makes up his mind. As the ritual builds to a climax he shatters the egg. Twilight's spell takes effect. Willow loses all her magical powers, and Buffy becomes a normal woman, not a Slayer.

Betrayal, for the best of motives.

The next episode then has Buffy treating Xander as her enemy, but reconciling with him in the final pages. And in the last issue of all, they defeat Twilight despite no longer having any superpowers... " by stormwreath.

[Cordelia Chase*]

I dont think it will be Xander or Willow. Im thinking all the Slayer girls, or Andrew.

Kennedy wouldnt do it because she knows how much WIllow oves magic, but then again she might be afraid that WIllow might do dark. so idk. BU t im sure that it wont be WIllow

[Joyce Summers]

Looking at this now I'm all confused. I don't know who to lean towards. And the concept that any of them could betray her hurts me .::sad puppy dog face::.
Though when I look at the reasons listed I find myself letting my suspicion senses lean towards Andrew. It's not that he's evil, just that when he gets too close to it (in this case Twilight or Warren or maybe even the Immortal- I mean we still technically don't know the deal on him....) he picks up it's flavor. Like a mushroom. Hehe. But then again, at the end of season seven we saw Andrew become a lot stronger person and I think he would be even more resolved towards good after his shock at being the one that survived when he thought he would die in the battle.

The other one I have suspicion for is Kennedy. Not because she hates magick and because she's a brat, but because of this mystical death Willow mentioned. Anything can happen during the time one is mystically dead (I'm not speaking from experience haha) and so anything could have gotten to her, reached her, converted her, even brainwashed her a la Spike/First in season 7, plus you would suspect she'd be even more hating of magick after dying because of it. However,Kennedy loves being a Slayer in the same way that Faith was for it in season 3 so why she want to get rid of that as well?

I really don't think it's Giles or Faith. Faith seems on the outs of most everything anyway and she is definitely playing for the good guys now and as for Giles, I could see him trying to get rid of it all so as to give Buffy the happy normal life she's always wanted, but he's too much big picture guy to not realize that there always has to be magick and good and evil so as to keep the world moving. It is integral to the world. So really don't think it could be him.

I'm praying it's not Xander because after all he's been through with Buffy, I really don't think he could betray like that. He loves her (how he loves her I'll leave to the interpretation of the shipper, haha) but that Stormwreath theory posted by Sosa Lola above does make sense in a Xander way. Which worries me, haha.

Personally I think it's one or more of the new Slayers. Fighting the battle because it's their destiny but not really wanting to, or maybe they just hate that Buffy's superior to them, or they may have been seduced by whoever is the face of evil this year. There's a lot of possible reasons one of the newbies could be the betrayer.

[Clem Rocks]

Maybe the closest to her hint means it'll be Buffy who betrays herself?

[Cordelia Chase*]

I was thinking that as well. I dont think its ANdrew because everybody atomatically assumes its him because they dont want it to be a scooby. An I dont think Joss would let it be Andrew because he knows everybody would want it to be him

[Kemy]

Kennedy. Better kill her now just to be sure. Even if its not her we're doing the world a favour and its not like theres just one Slayer anymore *nods*

[The Chosen]

I kinda think it's Willow. She's been gone for about a year, so she could have been working up some evil plants. Also, I've noticed that in all the covers/panels that Twilight has been in so far, there's a wierd fog. Willow's cover for number 3 has that fog. [insert shrug here] But it could easily be another person, I'm just not sure right now...

[GATEGOD]

Kennedy or Faith, definitely not. I voted for Willow but Dawn would be fun and.. unlikely too. Willow only because they had the entire issue about her and Buff.

Kennedy. Better kill her now just to be sure. Even if its not her we're doing the world a favour and its not like theres just one Slayer anymore *nods*

What is wrong with you.

So I voted for Willow

[LittleMissLikesToFight]

I think willow is too obvious. I'm going for Xander, just because Joss is evil like that!

[Keanoite]

I voted Andrew but the more I think about it the more Xander is jumping out at me. Of all the Scooby relationships since the comic started the Buffy/Xander interactions have been the most enjoyable. They have been so cute together, more than we have seen in years. I think of everyone mentioned Xander has a genuine belief that magic and everything that goes with it is bad and the world would be better without it. Just watching Willow, his best friend, be so corrupted by it would be reason enough for him. And well he is the only Scooby who hasn't tried to end the world yet and well Joss is pure evil so I kinda think we should be preparing for Evil Xand Man to make his presence known.

[Kemy]

What is wrong with you.

Excuse me? all I did was make a joke, stop being so vindictive GATEGOD.

[Cordelia Chase*]

Kennedy or Faith, definitely not. I voted for Willow but Dawn would be fun and.. unlikely too. Willow only because they had the entire issue about her and Buff.



What is wrong with you.

So I voted for Willow

NO....thats just problems between them. Which is normal for friends who have been best freidns for so long. Somewhere down the line you're gonna get conflict, but nothing they cant make right with each other again so they are good.

Besides, Willow said she wont betray Buffy already than what she has. When shes says this the thing that instantly pops in my mind is what she explained about Kennedy. About not wanting her to be around because of what happened with Tara. Kinda selfish, but understandable and there for Willow thinks she betray BUffy with all of that, the bringing her back and not wanting kennedy around.

I also think it would be Xander, But GOD I hope not. I think I'd cry and be devistated too.

No votes for Giles or Faith. They are too busy on there own trying to find more slayers and complete what ever missions they run into.

Dawn, she might argue and hate Buffy from time to time, but we all know that deep down she loves her. After all, they are literally one in the same. She wouldnt betray her sake of ending all magic and stuff.

Andrew....nah! I think he loves his active role of being in charge of the SLayer girls. He loves being apart of the gang even though they are seperate.

NOw they say theres a inside man, which means they already betrayed Buffy since issue one, so is the inside man the future Betrayer?? I think its a inside man and then someone close to her will i guess you could say maybe come to the light on some issues. Like seeing BUffy robbing the banks. Being reckless. Using her abilities to get what she wants. So they also may think that if other slayers do this as well there will be chaos in the world. Maybe they betray her for the sake of them thinking that they are helping somehow.

But as I say, I have a strong feeling that it wont be WIllow. I mean why would she want to end all magic? Hello! Shes a "goddess". Magic is what makes Willow Willow. Remember the early seasons of Buffy and how she struggled. I dont thik she'll say, "Oh. Im bored with this. I think I'll take all the magic from the world."

But thats my opinions and thoughts. But I hope that Xander and Willow have no part. If so, I know I'll be crushed! =(

[Kemy]

Anybody thinking that it may be Satsu?

We're all assuming it meant close in the friendship sense, what if Twilight and this demon from their more strategist point of view mean the Slayers themsevles, Satsu being Buffy's second in command and most trusted warrior among her new army.

Just saying.

[Cordelia Chase*]

Thats why I kept saying the Slayers. Satsu, second in command, may betray Buffy and lead some of the Slayers girls while doing it.

[Kemy]

And given how we're seeing some rebellious Slayers, maybe Joss is hinting at this growing trend not so subtly, hoping Satsu being the one among Buffy's own ranks turning against her will come as a shock, so much so it takes Buffy off guard, hence her lying wounded in the castle, surrounded by the shadows of the other Slayers?

Ohhh I hope Renee isn't one of them too, see how both Buffy and Xander strangely have a new Slayer buddying up to them?

[Cordelia Chase*]

I hope not but I am suspious of Renee though.

[Keanoite]

Hey lads remember we are here to have fun and discuss Buffy. Lets leave the bickering to the children. A difference of opinion is NO reason to fall out.

Ok let the discussion continue.

[LittleMissLikesToFight]

A slayer would make sense as "closest".... meaning most like her, most understanding of her situation, being a slayer as well?

[FaithyFivebyFive]

I voted 'somebody else', but now I think about it... Andrew is a strong suspect!

[nerd4hire]

Here's a possibility for Xander as traitor. It involves what's probably a spoiler for issue #13, so I guess I'd better tag it.

In #13 Dracula looks to be making an appearance. If that happens it would seem to make Dark Horse's previous TPB Tales of the Vampires canon. In that Xander spends a year under Dracula's thrall. If Dracula is in some way connected to Twilight that would create a situation under which Xander could be the traitor acting under Dracula's command

[alexa]

Here's a possibility for Xander as traitor. It involves what's probably a spoiler for issue #13, so I guess I'd better tag it.

In #13 Dracula looks to be making an appearance. If that happens it would seem to make Dark Horse's previous TPB Tales of the Vampires canon. In that Xander spends a year under Dracula's thrall. If Dracula is in some way connected to Twilight that would create a situation under which Xander could be the traitor acting under Dracula's command

I see where you're going with that, but god I hope not. The stuff in the tags isn't really spoilers so much as speculation, but anyway.

I know Xander was funny being Dracula's bitch, but I really hope Xander has a little more mind control by now.. it sort of belittles his character to be so easily manipulated, although it is funny.
It's going to be interesting though. Reading 'Antique' you can see that Dracula really cares for Xander.. and has some other kind of connection with Buffy. I can sort of see Dracula teaming up with the scoobies to be more likely because he needs to, in order to survive?

Hmm here's another thought. What if Twilight is someone Buffy knows? Thus the betrayer... yeah I know I'm reaching.

I liked the idea someone had that Twilight was really Caleb. That's why he needs all the plating and straps to hold himself together in the middle.

[Clem Rocks]

I see where you're going with that, but god I hope not. The stuff in the tags isn't really spoilers so much as speculation, but anyway.

I know Xander was funny being Dracula's bitch, but I really hope Xander has a little more mind control by now.. it sort of belittles his character to be so easily manipulated, although it is funny.
It's going to be interesting though. Reading 'Antique' you can see that Dracula really cares for Xander.. and has some other kind of connection with Buffy. I can sort of see Dracula teaming up with the scoobies to be more likely because he needs to, in order to survive?

Hmm here's another thought. What if Twilight is someone Buffy knows? Thus the betrayer... yeah I know I'm reaching.

I liked the idea someone had that Twilight was really Caleb. That's why he needs all the plating and straps to hold himself together in the middle.

Ooooo that would make sense! =D
Hope he doesn't get pokey with people's eyes again though >_<

[CharmedSlayer85]

I think I know who the traitor is. It's Satsu. I mean think about it, somebody that Buffy would least expect, of course she wouldn't expect the person that professed her love for her. Also out of all the slayers Buffy likes Satsu and believes Satsu to be her best fighter, and also Buffy likes having Satsu around and enjoys her company and will more than likely grow to trust her, so who knows maybe because Buffy herself isn't gay Satsu will grow upset and betray her, or maybe she's betraying her now by being the inside woman.

[Cangel]

I voted Giles. After all, he has betrayer Buffy more than once. He always does what he thinks would be best. Like the time he and principal wood ploted to kill Spike

[Joyce Summers]

I know Giles has sometimes made decisions behind Buffy's back but it's always been Fatherly decisions- getting rid of Spike for example was just the equivalent of a parent trying to push away a bad love interest for their children, but I don't think he would ever outright betray her. He cares about her and loves her way too much

Personally my money is either on Satsu or Renee, possibly both as I think it is suspicious that each of them are cuddling up to Xander and Buffy at the same time. On the other hand Amy's spell proved that while Buffy doesn't feel the same way, Satsu is in true love with Buffy so I doubt she'd betray her if she feels that strongly about her. But then again, as Willow said, love makes you do the wacky.

Renee is very suspicious though....and Xander has always attracted the demonic/bad women, you know the ones who aren't generally trustworthy so Renee would fit the profile....

[Black Eye Guy]

I don't think it will be a core member, Making it Xander wouldn't be cool, Willows already gone bad, and Buffy would look at what happened with Giles as a betrayal.

I think it's going to be Satsu or Renee, just cuz the two of them have been pointed out above the rest, Joss did the same thing with Amanda in season 7, we saw her playing the game with the gang in Chosen and then she died, it was set up to make us like her and then fell crappy with her death.

Renee and Satsu have been set up the same way, we want to see Xander with Renee cuz it would be nice for him, and we have grown to like Satsu cuz shes a good character.

I don't think it would be Kennedy cuz I think when she was making her apology to Willow for being a brat in the last issue I think was aimed more at us, I think that was the start of a growth for Kennedy and we gonna see her more and more and build her up as a character, which was what we were missing in season 7!

[ckg927]

I know it's in Joss' nature to do plot twists that make us want to tear our hair out,but....sometimes,the most obvious choice is but a ruse to throw us off the scent. (Which see,Andrew.)

Giles and Faith I can't really see,since they're now going all "The Avengers" on us.

Willow...can't see it myself,PLUS she's already gone down the path. Something really nasty would have to happen for her to return to the dark side.

Kennedy? Maybe...she's still enigmatic to me.

Buffy? Don't think so,but she mind end up losing a bit more than she expects to.

Dawn? Enchanted though she may be,I don't think it's her.

That's why I chose "someone else". And it'll probably be someone we haven't seen yet.

[Allycat]

I think people have mentioned in the official discussion of this month's issue (12), that the vampire-gang very easily gained access to the Slayers' castle. They also knew where the armoury was, which indicates that they may have a mole in the organisation. Or, if that they're working for Twilight and are using his mole. Or Twilight might have infiltrated their organisation and gave them the intel on the castle, hoping that a fight between the Slayers and the Vampires would only further his goal.

Anyway, what I was wondering about. How did the wolves enter the castle? Willow was taken out. Xander was with Renee. Buffy with Satsu. Andrew was doped up on dramamime. Dawn was sleeping? Who let them in? A new character? Or perhaps they just used their fog-abilities to slide under the door?!? Still how did they know where to find the armoury? Some food for thought perhaps.

[white avenger]

MAY BE A SPOILER!!!! READ AT YOUR OWN RISK!!!




Given the events in Issue 12, I'm seriously wondering now if the traitor just might be Satsu

[Rowan Hawthorn]

Given the same events, I'm seriously wondering if it might not be one of the other two in Buffy's elite squad.

[Joyce Summers]

MAY BE A SPOILER!!!! READ AT YOUR OWN RISK!!!




Given the events in Issue 12, I'm seriously wondering now if the traitor just might be Satsu

I agree. I mean she has wangled her way into the inner circle so to speak. But then again so has Renee. I'm keeping my eye on the both of them.....:: Suspicious Hairy Eyeball Giving::

[white avenger]

Then again, if Xander were under some sort of thrall from someone who refers to him as "Manservant" and seems to have a connection with the new Japanese vampires, that might work, too.

[Joyce Summers]

Ooooh, interesting (and good) point. See, that's the problem with this thread for me. People seem to be so easily able to flip me from one idea to another. I just can't seem to stay firm!! Haha

[Allycat]

Okay, after reading today's issue, I've decided I have enough "evidence" to really start pointing fingers here. I think Renee is the mole.

1) Has anyone else noticed that Renee is always wearing a suspiciously large earring? She always wears only one. Looks the same every time, only the colour changes and she doesn't always wear it in the same ear. Could be a bug?

2) And the two times we've seen the castle be attacked, she was on guard duty. In the case of the Zombies, she and the other Slayer didn't notice, because they were chatting about her private life. She did get injured, but not killed, even though she was the first person who had to fight the zombies. Normally, casualties are always highest on the front-line.

3) Now in issue 12, the castle is attacked again. Xander and Renee are on guard duty. They see wolves. It's only wolves... no reason to panic, right? But no, Renee suggests looking into it and they leave the guard post. Which means the wolves can now freely use their morphing abilities to turn into fog, without Xander noticing and raising the alarm.

4) Last but certainly not least. Scott Allie said that they had a last name for Renee, but not for Satsu. Why? Maybe because we have already been introduced to her mother, who was introduced by her last name; Lieutenant Mottler.

[nerd4hire]

I always had a suspicion Renee's earring was meant to signify her racial heritage. It looks native North American. I'm not sure I get why it being on one ear, or another makes it more, or less a bug.

[Allycat]

I always had a suspicion Renee's earring was meant to signify her racial heritage. It looks native North American. I'm not sure I get why it being on one ear, or another makes it more, or less a bug.

I would say it makes it more of a bug. If it was a sign of racial heritage, some kind of Native American or African American (is she even American at all?) cultural item, then it would probably be subject to all kinds of traditions. Traditions usually have strict rules guiding them, not always logical, but there's always some kind of pattern. There's no pattern to which ear she wears it in. (Or maybe there is and I haven't figured it out yet.)

It's not the main argument anyway, but I feel it's just one of those extra things that makes you wonder. Like I said, if it was some traditional item, there would probably be a rule as to only wear it left, or only right. At least, that's what I think.

[nerd4hire]

No man, you don't get it, and I think it's because you're not North American. Depending on the part of NA you live in and how influenced it is by native heritage, you'll find all these native art oriented shops, and beaded-cloth, earrings are always prominent. They've been adapted to white culture of course, and you'll find them everywhere now, but the feeling is you think of them as being native Indian.

There's no real traditional, cultural thing attached. It's complicated, and it's simple. Basically with native North Americans you have all these many varied bands, and they borrow from each other's cultures which creates this kind of mish mash of cultural references from all the different tribes you'll find in all North American shops with a native art slant. Beaded-cloth earrings you'll find in shops centered on the North Coastal Haida art, or South Western Navajo, and all points in between.

[Joyce Summers]

I think what you're saying N4H is that lots of past cultural and native american attire traditions have mish mashed together to create some very pretty jewelery that anyone can buy anywhere and so it no longer has any cultural importance or significance beyond design. We have one such store near where I live. And I often wander in....haha.

Back on topic though- you people have swung me again. I was stuck between it either being Renee or Satsu, but what Allycat said about the guard duty coincidences and other things I've read, Renee seems a more likely suspect. Plus, although we know the whole Satsu storyline was an apparent one off according to Joss and so that could make her legit for betrayal- her kiss in the 3rd issue proved it wasn't just a crush but true love, making it much less likely she would betray Buffy (Or more so depending how cynical you are about love and it's affects).
So yeah, I'm thinking Renee. And the whole learning-comic-cult-characters and the like that she did at the beginning of the season just seemed all too planned when you look back. Like she was purposefully trying to wangle her way into Xander's life and therefore the inner circle as we all know that anyone who dates a Scooby becomes a Scooby by default. Plus her cover would allow her to smooch Xander. It's win/win for her.

[Clem Rocks]

Just something i'd like to point out quickly, despite most of you guessing the same person for both, i don't think it's been stated that the traitor and the inside man/woman/slayer are the same person, they might not even be connected

[white avenger]

How about this for a mind bender: Satsu and Renee are in cahoots to betray the Slayers. Buffy and Xander wind up having to kill their respective girl friends and wind up consoling each other which leads to a wild passionate affair, which ends tragically when Xander gets turned and Buffy has to stake him after he kills Kennedy. Then Buffy and Willow console each other over their mutual loss, which leads to a wild, passionate affair... It's got Whedon outrage written all over it.

[iluvcosmo14]

Though it would result in massive death tolls, I vote for that one!!! *looks up*

[TabulaRasa]

As mentioned, it could be satsu, and like I said...imagine that! Satsu, the traitor, gets Buffy in her bed. YOWSA! Imagine the drama.