George the Fish - Yay or Nay?

[nerd4hire]

I see lots of pro and con arguments concerning Beta George in Angel: After the Fall.

I think it's time to ask the question head-on. Beta George - Yay, or nay?

[VisionGuy]

Nay! He needs to be deep fried already. I don't like the idea of using a formerly non canon character and make him canon. Especially when it's a freaking fish. COME ON!!!!

[Keanoite]

I think the fish can be witty at times I just don't see what he has to do with Angel. I don't think it is needed, it's distracting and personally causes me to take After the Fall less seriously because they have just thrown this random character in and made him part of canon and that I do not like.

[Tranquillity]

i don't love the fish but i have nothing against the fish either. my kids love the fish.

[GATEGOD]

I don't get the whole point of the fish or how it is even there.. :s Maybe if I knew something about it I would be inclined to like it.

[nerd4hire]

Every frame of that fish is one where they don't deal with the characters I actually care about, and take the story farther away from the one I want to know about.

[Keanoite]

To me it feels like Joss is allowing the fish so that After the Fall will seem more like Brian Lynch's baby, and thus distancing himself from it. I just find the vagueness surrounding whats canon and whats not a little weird. Like Joss could come out in how many's years time and say, you know what scratch that, L.A. never went to hell, here's what actually happened.

I believe what is happening with S8 could be something to happen on the tv show albeit in a much smaller scale and the fact that Joss is so heavenly involved makes it feel like Buffy. I don't feel that with ATF...ATF isn't the show I watched for 5 years...

[GATEGOD]

Every frame of that fish is one where they don't deal with the characters I actually care about, and take the story farther away from the one I want to know about.

Yea, I'm voting for The only fish I want to see when I read A:ATF would come with chips.

[nerd4hire]

The fish is on the cover of First Night. First Night is supposed to deal with how the characters get out of the alley in Not Fade Away. What in all the verse of Whedon does that silly fish have to do with Not Fade Away?

[white avenger]

To me it feels like Joss is allowing the fish so that After the Fall will seem more like Brian Lynch's baby, and thus distancing himself from it. I just find the vagueness surrounding whats canon and whats not a little weird. Like Joss could come out in how many's years time and say, you know what scratch that, L.A. never went to hell, here's what actually happened.
..


Kinda like what he did with "The Girl In Question," you mean? Granted, there wasn't any footnote or epilogue saying, "Don't worry, viewers, that isn't the REAL Buffy out there dancing with Angel and Spike's mortal enemy. Everything will be explained someday when we have a Season 8 in comic book form." but I still feel a little bit betrayed (besides, it invalidates almost all of the fan fiction I've ever written).

As for the fish, I'm not sure whether we're supposed to see it as a serious addition to the story or just some sort of comedy relief.

[Senior Watcher]

nay, nay, nay, nay, nay, nay! the fish has got to go. i dont care what brian did in past comics. i want to read about the angel universe.

sorry if i sound upset, i am not fond of how ATF is being written and drawn.

[alexa]

Yay. Big yay actually. I'm usually reluctant to welcome newbie characters at first, but I love him. I like how he talks and relates to other characters.. especially in the scene with Gunn- 'Ok the vampire that took me against my will in a kidsnapsque type of way' He also has a really cute face.
I didn't like how he was depicted in the First Night cover much though.

[Dlou444]

You know, you needed another option. I wouldn't say I LOVE George, but I don't want him fried.

But, I do like George. I mean, between the two shows we've had all sorts of demons and ooky, wiggly, slimey things. I think he's like Clem...only slightly more appealing looking. I don't really care where he came from, but then again, I really liked Asylum and Shadow Puppets. And I'd kind of like to see how he fits into the alley scene. I can't picture it, but on the other hand, I can't picture them getting out of the alley at all.

And, even though you're right about him taking up scene space...the ones WITH the characters I care about are either confusing or moving in a weird slow and not so much explainy pace. Which makes George slightly more enjoyable to me because at least I can understand him! Blame the blonde!

Wanabee-slayer is the goddess of all that is pink and fluffy in the world

[Allycat]

I'm gonna wait with voting on this poll. George's inclusion in AAtF was Joss' idea, so I guess there must be something cool about him. Now, I personally haven't seen it, but he's only been in two scenes so far. I don't really mind him being there; he's mildly amusing. I just hope that he has a relevant role to play in the upcoming plot, cause if he does, I don't mind him being there, but I wouldn't like it, if he's just there cause Brian likes him.

[Cordelia Chase*]

I dont mind the fish being there. He's entertaining. Maybe he has a bigger role in the end, to help out ANgel somehow with all the Hell going on.

[Gilesau]

He is a waste of space.

[tommy]

Yeah, I don't see why such a bizarre character has to be a regular, and it's not even been explained yet. Weird stuff happens in Buffy and Angel, but this seems random.

[littlewilly]

Is the fish real or in the imagination. Real=bad imagination=good

Keanoite said in an earlier post that she could see Joss saying in a few years that ATF aint canon and LA didnt go to hell and that he could come up with something new.
If that happened i would be annoyed as the only reason im getting them is because its canon and ive got to find out how the official story plays out.

[Dlou444]

George is like Kudzu, I like the little guy. Of course, I liked him better in Asylum and Shadow Puppets, but maybe that's because he's doing a lot of being tied to beds in ATF.
He's at least as believable as Lorne, for goodness sake. Weird green guy in flashy suits with horns that can read people's aura's, future's, intentions, whatever while they sing? Surely that isn't any more weird than adorable, sarcastic floaty fish that can read minds.

[palabravampiress]

I feel indifferent to the fish. I would find him more interesting, I think, if he spent more time with our main characters.

That said, I think I'd like AAtF a lot better if our main characters spent more time with one another or were at least more clearly defined (which ones are major and which ones are minor, I mean), so I'm not sure I can blame the fish so much for being kinda isolated when, right now, all of the characters feel rather isolated. I think there are too many characters and that's why I'm not really feeling George, you know? In like every issue, a new character is revealed. It's hard enough to follow Angel, Wes, Lorne, Connor, Spike, Illyria, Gwen, Nina, Groo, Kate, and Gunn on their different and sometimes intersecting adventures all over the city; with all of them so scattered, I really don't have the mental capacity to care one way or the other about someone new. I wanna know who the main villain is, who Angel's main crew is, and then focus on those people. Right now, there are too many characters claiming my attention -- and the fish is sort of at the bottom of that list as far as importance goes.

[Tranquillity]

On Brian Lynch's blog he mentions a forum with a thread calling for George's blood. Do you think this one is the thread in question? some of the comments seem to suggest so.

Brian Lynch (http://bloglynch.blogspot.com/)

[Dlou444]

Poor George! I don't want him to die! The poor fish already had to die once in order to be immortalized....he doesn't deserve to die again, he's just a cute little fish. Maybe a bit on the weird side, but cute!

[Exitmat]

I think fans are being way too hard on George and forgetting that not every character in the Buffy and Angel universes were created and developed by Joss in the first place. And neither was every major storyline in the Buffy and Angelverse. This is no different. One of Joss's writers created a character, Joss loved it, and so he gave it his stamp of approval. Same thing he did countless times on the TV show.

I think the difference here is that since it's so out in the open that George was not a Joss creation, and since it's such an outrageous character, it's naturally inviting all sorts of fans that are looking for something to be upset over so they can feel more involved.

The fish is so not the big deal people are making it out to be. Personally I enjoy the fish as a secondary character. But even if I didn't, I don't think I'd care enough to not like it or even waste my time telling anybody. The character's role is minimal and it's not interfering with any of the major character's stories. Really--what has the character done that people feel is such an injustice to the Angelverse? Nothing.

I think a lot of people need to just find something more interesting to latch onto for discussion than complaining about George. It's just petty.

[LorneyTunes]

i love the fish , its so weird having a big fish floating about lol x

[Allycat]

I think fans are [...] forgetting that not every character in the Buffy and Angel universes were created and developed by Joss in the first place. [...] One of Joss's writers created a character, Joss loved it, and so he gave it his stamp of approval. Same thing he did countless times on the TV show.

I think the difference here is that since it's so out in the open that George was not a Joss creation.

You bring up a very good point. I mean when you think about we know Joss made up Angel, Buffy Cordelia, Giles, Harmony, Willow, and Xander. But was he the also responsible for every single character created thereafter? People like Spike and Anya, maybe. Although those people could have been team efforts. But how about Gwen? And think about Dracula... he was a Bram Stoker creation and Marti Noxon turned him into a Buffyverse character, although the idea for the episode may have come from Joss. However, it was Drew Goddard who turned Dracula into a well-liked character.

[Exitmat]

You bring up a very good point. I mean when you think about we know Joss made up Angel, Buffy Cordelia, Giles, Harmony, Willow, and Xander...

And even Angel was co-created by David Greenwalt.