Shhh - I think I'm starting to like Riley

[groovygarden]

Having spent season 4 bemoaning the whole sorry Initiative/Riley "storyline", now, 8 eps into season 5, I'm starting to like Riley and feel a bit sorry for him. Didn't see that coming! Despite the cheesy "split in two" lines before it, when, at the end of "The Replacement", he said "But she doesn't love me" - argh. I'd class that as one of the saddest scenes on the show ever. His life has been turned upside down - he's lost his career, his purpose, his whole Initiative family and his souped-up fighting powers. He knows the girl he loves doesn't love him, doesn't need him emotionally, and thinks he's a liability when she's fighting.

And he's actually not a bad boyf! He loves Buff, wants to be there for her, has some understanding of her "work", is really sweet with Dawn and isn't undead. Wasn't it so that Buff could be with someone like that that Angel left Sunnydale? Granted Riley should make some allowances for what she's going through with Joyce's illness, but I think he's (understandably?) preoccupied the massive changes in his life and the knowledge that, sooner or later, Buffy will leave him. Then he really will have nothing left.

[Blondie Bear]

You might feel differently in a few episodes. . . :whistle:

I liked Riley, too, overall. He just felt out of place for this show. He was great in We Were Soldiers, though (basically same character, but in Vietnam!).

[LittleMissLikesToFight]

I'm more of a fan of Riley in season 4 than 5 actually, and i think im pretty alone in that one. he was just misguided by the initiative, but you could tell from the start he was dedicated to Buffy. Maybe he did some rash things and seemed a bit of a goof, but i liked him a lot.

[Aussie]

I preferred him in season 4 too. He was cute and goofy and I felt like he was a lost little puppy just doing as he was told! He had no one to tell him what to do in season 5 and it seemed very awkward and he appeared to be really needy to me.. More like a big brother or family friend then a buffy lover. I never got the same sense from them as a couple as I did with angel or spike, Passionless I suppose :/
He was perfect for her in most ways except for the fact that there was no spark?

[Buffy obsessed fan]

I saw season five prior to season four, so when I tuned into season 4 my first reaction was 'Woah, is this really the same guy...?' in season four, I kinda liked Riley, but season five came and that went out of the window...

[Joyce Summers]

I always liked Riley. If you take him as an individual and not as 'Buffy's boyfriend' there is the potential to see how great he is. He's sweet, wants to be a gentlemen like his Father taught him, is protective, strong, caring, loving and I suspect very family oriented. He's wonderful. BUT he wasn't right for Buffy and since we tend to see the show through mostly Buffy's perspective, this fact kept us alerted to more of his bad points than his good.
Riley, with all those qualities I mentioned above, needs to be the strong one in the relationship, to feel he's needed-to protect her or whatever- but since Buffy is the Slayer she never needs him in that way, or at all, she just wants him. Which was why their relationship was never right or had the passion Bangel or Spuffy had.

Riley was great (IMO) but Briley/Ruffy was not.

[groovygarden]

Oh dear. I'm getting the impression he's going to do something awful in the next few episodes...!

[GATEGOD]

Having spent season 4 bemoaning the whole sorry Initiative/Riley "storyline", now, 8 eps into season 5, I'm starting to like Riley and feel a bit sorry for him. Didn't see that coming! Despite the cheesy "split in two" lines before it, when, at the end of "The Replacement", he said "But she doesn't love me" - argh. I'd class that as one of the saddest scenes on the show ever. His life has been turned upside down - he's lost his career, his purpose, his whole Initiative family and his souped-up fighting powers. He knows the girl he loves doesn't love him, doesn't need him emotionally, and thinks he's a liability when she's fighting.

And he's actually not a bad boyf! He loves Buff, wants to be there for her, has some understanding of her "work", is really sweet with Dawn and isn't undead. Wasn't it so that Buff could be with someone like that that Angel left Sunnydale? Granted Riley should make some allowances for what she's going through with Joyce's illness, but I think he's (understandably?) preoccupied the massive changes in his life and the knowledge that, sooner or later, Buffy will leave him. Then he really will have nothing left.

That's what happened to me when I watched season 4. Seeing him it put me off Riley. He was too.. eww. But at the beginning of season 5 I started to like him. He seemed more real I guess.

[Clem Rocks]

Keep watching, you'll soon hate him again =]

[palabravampiress]

I liked Riley, too. And I didn't think the relationship lacked sparkage. I just think it lacked build-up to said sparkage. They teased Bangel and Spuffy for a long time prior to letting that lead to anything physical. On TV shows, denial of lust = flamey goodness. With Buffy and Riley, they gave us a couple of episodes and then they were suddenly boinking buddies. There was a spark there, for sure. Some of their scenes were hot. Some were sweet. They were genuinely attracted to one another.

The spark just wasn't properly cultivated. You know how when you're building a fire, you have to first get a spark on the tinder, then add more tinder and blow a little bit until you get a flame, and then add a little bit of kindling and add more kindling and tinder until you get a blaze, and only then add fuel (logs) to keep the fire burning high and bright? Well, writing a romance is the same way. If you blow too hard or add the kindling too soon or something, all you end up with is a bunch of smoke. That's what they did with Riley and Buffy. They didn't tease it out or coax it out little by little, they just jumped in so that the entire meeting, attraction, courtship, relationship, breakdown, and breakup lasted for a season-and-a-half.

By contrast, look at Bangel and Spuffy. They pretty much spent a season-and-a-half just building up to Bangel, and then they doused the flames right quick, leaving us wanting more. After Angel came back, pretty much all they did was hint and tease and build up. The same was true for Spike. There was always an underlying little bit of sexual tension. Just a bit. It grew, little by little, from seasons 2 to 6 until it finally just exploded. And then they did the same thing: they doused the flames after only a handful of episodes. When Spike came back with his soul, they gave us another entire season of build-up. Both pairings spent most of their time in a state of perpetual spark-nursing, leaving the audience desperate for a little bit of flame. They didn't do that with Riley, and that, I think, it why that pairing was unpopular.


Slayer Comma The agrees: Whoa. Over-boardiness with the fire/flame analogy. Haha. But I liked it. :-)

Sorry. Lifetime Girl Scout. Sometimes, it comes out. You should see me tie a knot. lol.

[kanani]

Riley was great (IMO) but Briley/Ruffy was not.


I didn't realize how much I agree with this until I saw it written.

He was really "eh." for me the first time I saw the series. The second time I watched it felt like I was watching a different character almost. I really felt for him and them and the way they parted was really sad. It was over so much that wasn't said or done, not the other way around. At the same time, I was glad to see him go cause even though I liked 'him', I was over 'them'. You know, for me, the Riley relationship came off as that even with a human who knew about, dealt, captured, beat and held their own with the demon world, Buffy just wasn't, I don't know, capable and/or built-for an intimate relationship. No slayer is. If she gets to be in love, and get her freak on, it's gonna be with a demon kind. She was pushing it big-time by just having friends** much less be a girlfriend/lover/domestic goddess by day, demon hunter/slayer by night.


** which is a totally kickass dichotomy to have as a show as that's what saved her ass and kept her alive so long. and what a treat for the writers... not only are they amazing to begin with, but they get to work around the chosen, "lone" slayer character... who travels with a mom and a Scooby Gang. so cool.

[white avenger]

It was easy to like Riley, especially in Season 4, he was just this big happy school boy kind of guy with a sort of secret identity as "Rambo Riley, Boy Commando" who was just puppy dog crazy over Buffy and her whole demon fighting life style. When I began to really dislike the guy was when he started slapping Spike around. Now, granted, Spike deserved a certain bit of the abuse he got, but he was, after all, helpless to defend himself, and it was almost as if Riley started taking out all of his frustrations on him. Riley couldn't beat Buffy, so he took his frustrations out on someone who, under normal circumstances, could snap his spine without even trying.

[Bangelxx]

i do not like riley. end of story.

[Elithustra]

I'm with Bangel. I couldn't stand Riley. Whiney, horrible, I just couldn't stand the guy and couldn't find a decent thing to say about him if I was threatened with hot bamboo shoots under the nails as punishment. I mean, he just struck me as someone who was rather arrogant and controlling and continued to be like that until he had to change, and even then, the whiff of arrogance remained in the air!

[Joyce Summers]

I'm with Bangel. I couldn't stand Riley. Whiney, horrible, I just couldn't stand the guy and couldn't find a decent thing to say about him if I was threatened with hot bamboo shoots under the nails as punishment. I mean, he just struck me as someone who was rather arrogant and controlling and continued to be like that until he had to change, and even then, the whiff of arrogance remained in the air!

I don't think arrogant is ever a word I would use to describe Riley. Or controlling. He just had very traditional views/values with an extremely protective personality.
He never sought to control Buffy, in fact he was awed by her strength and slayerness and thought it made them even more matched as a couple ("Doomed"), but what he was unable to understand was that no matter what, no matter how much her family and friends love her and are there for her, the Slayer is always alone in the end and they cannot rely on anyone else completely or allow their emotions to be let out. And Riley, wanting to protect her and take care of her as he believed a gentlemen should, interpreted this as rejection on his part rather than seeing it as just who Buffy was.
Continuously he just wanted Buffy to be happy and to not have to have all this strain and worry on her shoulders- he wanted her to let it all out when her Mom was ill remember? Just so she wouldn't have to be the brave strong one all the time. He thought he was helping her by offering her that chance to just let all her emotions out. But Buffy has never and will never be able to do that. Because allowing her emotions to control her even to that extent would weaken her and make her vulnerable as a Slayer and that was one thing Riley could never fully understand, no matter how much he tried.
It's sort of linked to Buffy's cookie dough speech. While she was dough, he was already cookies. He had already become the 'marrying settling down' kind while Buffy was not.

[definition of insane]

I didn't mind Riley at first. Did I think he was a good choice for Buffy? Not really. I think she needed to go through what she did with Riley to show her that what normal girls get isn't really going to work for her. Sure, he's the type of guy you take home to mum, but at the same time, you're eyeing off the hot looking bikie down the street or something.

Where he really lost me though was when he lost what strength he had. He had an army and after leaving it behind he was just scenery and he knew it. Almost the same sort of thing as the whole I Will Remember You scenario. Buffy needs someone who has their own amount of strength to bring to the relationship. It'll never equal hers (unless she one day gets with Faith) but it's bound to be beyond human.

[VisionGuy]

I liked Riley when he was regular Joe up until the seaon four episode "The Initiative."

[Blondie Bear]

As I've said, I like Riley, but I felt that the Buffy-Riley relationship was forced. Especially in "The Initiative" when he just kind of stumbles onto the idea (with some help from his friends) that he likes Buffy and decides to ask her out. And bombs. Everything seemed just so forced and over-the-top on his part. The character they'd developed up until that point didn't seem the type to sit on the couch and mentally beat himself up over flopping with this girl he barely knows! Honestly, if I'd had to guess early on, I'd have guessed that Riley would like Willow, not Buffy.

[TabulaRasa]

I have a love/hate relationship with him. Sometimes I love him, sometimes I hate him. I generally do not like him tho. Simple as that.

[WickedWillow]

I thought Riley was a pretty good boyfriend where Buffy was concerned. He just got a little too jealous. But I didn't mind him. Not my favorite character ever but not terrible.

[Joyce Summers]

Everything seemed just so forced and over-the-top on his part. The character they'd developed up until that point didn't seem the type to sit on the couch and mentally beat himself up over flopping with this girl he barely knows!

I think that was kind of the point. While I'll admit that the whole way through the relationship, like Xander said, Buffy was sorta treating him like the rebound guy. But for Riley it was head over heels stuff and I think I would go so far as to say Buffy was his first love. And this love he had for, or at the beginning I suppose you could say overwhelming attraction made the usually wordy, clever, in control soldier boy fluff everything up! The way she made him feel caused him to be nervous and flustered and that's what they were showing. I just thought he looked so sweet when he was sat on the sofa with Will looking dejected (And I love when he gets the Dingoes' song changed for her).

[Kana]

Like most I kind of didn't want to like him. He was the anti-Angel and I like Angel. I had to open up to a new possibility and that was something Buffy tried to do (well in the end). He was, well likeable and different and sometimes we need that. Interestingly he was the only one out of Buffy's beaus to be fully intergrated into her life, in terms of her friends and family. He's actually the boy you can bring home to Mum.

[LittleMissLikesToFight]

Well all i know is, id love a boyfriend like Riley...er...not to say i dont love the boyfriend i have (oh geez thank god he won't ever see this post lol). I love when he told buffy that she made his whole body hum... thats like...wow. just so awesome.

[Fake Shemp]

i didnt have a problem with him first time round but the last time i watched it he was grating my cheese

[LittleMissLikesToFight]

I think for me, the first time i saw it aired, i was indifferent to him. then, the second time when i went through my dvds, i didnt like him. now the 3rd time, i do.

[Blondie Bear]

I think Buffy ruined him. He was such a sweet guy before the whole leaving-the-Initiative-for-Buffy thing and the her-not-needing-to-lean-on-him thing. Then he turned into a needy, whiny, annoying person.

[Hello Cutie]

I never GOT Riley. I mean yeah, I get the character, and I understand what he did blah blah, but him, as a person, I didn't get. He was just so wooden... literally to the point where sometimes I thought I could almost SEE the wooden broom handle shoved up his backside!!

And him and Buffy were just so... blah. Spike was right when he said that she needed some monster in her man. Riley (even when you find out he was Initiative) as a person, was just so boring. Good, solid old Riley, so boring and oh yeah, demanding for the time of a girl who's mother is potentially dying!!! Okay, so he doesn't say "urgh, why dont you spend time with me?" but he might as well have done, the way he was acting...

Also, he was just too nice!!!

i think my main problem was that he really was "the boyfriend you bring home to mummy" and if you got rid of the whole 'Initiative' aspect, and the 'slayer' aspect... (so if you saw them down the street together and didnt know them), they were the typical couple that makes me want to puke.... i dont know why, they just were!!

[disco biscuit]

Well, I never really HATED Riley, but I never liked him, either. But I liked Briley more than Spuffy...I couldn't stand Spuffy! Still, I'm a Bangel fan all the way. -prepares to get shot :[-

[Hello Cutie]

Well, I never really HATED Riley, but I never liked him, either. But I liked Briley more than Spuffy...I couldn't stand Spuffy! Still, I'm a Bangel fan all the way. -prepares to get shot :[-

Noo!! How could you hate Spuffy!!! I got annoyed with Spuffy once Spike had a soul, but pre-soul Spuffy (as in Buffy using him while he loved her)- genius!

But Bangel is the original, and as such should not be messed with.

[Joyce Summers]

Orignally posted by Hello Cutie
I never GOT Riley. I mean yeah, I get the character, and I understand what he did blah blah, but him, as a person, I didn't get. He was just so wooden... literally to the point where sometimes I thought I could almost SEE the wooden broom handle shoved up his backside!!

And him and Buffy were just so... blah. Spike was right when he said that she needed some monster in her man. Riley (even when you find out he was Initiative) as a person, was just so boring. Good, solid old Riley, so boring and oh yeah, demanding for the time of a girl who's mother is potentially dying!!! Okay, so he doesn't say "urgh, why dont you spend time with me?" but he might as well have done, the way he was acting...

See, I think that was always misunderstood about Riley in season 5. His attitude wasn't that he wanted time with Buffy while Joyce was ill, he just wanted to help Buffy. Buffy was having to take on the role of the matriarch while her Mom was ill and had to be in charge and in control all the time, and never showing how upset she was because that would upset her Mom and Dawn. So Riley wanted her to let it all out when she was with him for her sake. He was the one person she could turn to and not have to be strong; that was the way he could help. But she didn't let him. She shut him out completely. Which, while you can excuse Buffy anything at that point with everything she was going through at that point, hurt Riley. It'd be like someone I love being ill and me saying to my husband 'No, I can't tell you how I feel. And please stay out of the room at the hospital'. It would hurt my husband's feelings deeply and he would want to know why I couldn't share with him. It's a thing solid couples are meant to do. When you are strong everywhere else you can be weak in front of each other. But I definitely don't think Riley was being selfish. He was being supportive and trying to help her, but yet again she wouldn't let him. And after being 'not let' so many times he's going to start wondering whether the relationship is going anywhere at all. You can only stay in a one-sided relationship for so long.

Also, he was just too nice!!!

i think my main problem was that he really was "the boyfriend you bring home to mummy" and if you got rid of the whole 'Initiative' aspect, and the 'slayer' aspect... (so if you saw them down the street together and didnt know them), they were the typical couple that makes me want to puke.... i dont know why, they just were!!

What's wrong with nice?! Haha.
My husband was always the bring-home-to-Mom type and I love him to bits. When you're a teenager you want the rebel, the mysterious guy. You're after a thrill. But you get even just a little bit older and people tend to want the solid guy. And that's what Riley was (and god, did I love him for it. You may have guessed I'm a Riley fan)
My relationship with my husband is very Riley/Buffy (Before he went all crazy mid-season 5. Also he hasn't been in the army....as far as I know). We're the solid, embarrasingly loved-up couple (I'll admit it okay, people?! haha) so I'm afraid we would probably make you puke also. Which is a shame. :)

[Hello Cutie]

See, I think that was always misunderstood about Riley in season 5. His attitude wasn't that he wanted time with Buffy while Joyce was ill, he just wanted to help Buffy.

Oh I completely understand all that, and it was unfair to him in that sense, but I can see (from Buffy's view) how it'd come across like he was doing everything i said earlier... especially since Buffy's always been 'alone'- the whole, even though you're surrounded by people, its the lonliest place to be, senario- and i think to her, it was as though, by trying to take her mind off of it, and share her burden, it was more like he was trying to get her to notice him and give him more attention!


What's wrong with nice?! Haha.
My husband was always the bring-home-to-Mom type and I love him to bits. When you're a teenager you want the rebel, the mysterious guy. You're after a thrill. But you get even just a little bit older and people tend to want the solid guy. And that's what Riley was (and god, did I love him for it. You may have guessed I'm a Riley fan)
My relationship with my husband is very Riley/Buffy (Before he went all crazy mid-season 5. Also he hasn't been in the army....as far as I know). We're the solid, embarrasingly loved-up couple (I'll admit it okay, people?! haha) so I'm afraid we would probably make you puke also. Which is a shame. :)

Haha, just double check you're husband doesn't take any 'vitamins' then, cuz you never know where the government is infiltrating nowadays!:lmao:
But oh, my boyfriend is the bring home to mummy kind too, and i love him to bits, but i dunno.... as a couple we're not loved up cuz im rather standoffish (okay, im a bitca).... anyway, i just never thought that sort of relationship suited Buffy- she's a slayer, like a superhero, so she kinda needs a superhero boyfriend, not Joe regular that she can be all cute and cuddly with- it never made sense to me really, but then, each to their own...

[Joyce Summers]

Haha, just double check you're husband doesn't take any 'vitamins' then, cuz you never know where the government is infiltrating nowadays!
But oh, my boyfriend is the bring home to mummy kind too, and i love him to bits, but i dunno.... as a couple we're not loved up cuz im rather standoffish (okay, im a bitca).... anyway, i just never thought that sort of relationship suited Buffy- she's a slayer, like a superhero, so she kinda needs a superhero boyfriend, not Joe regular that she can be all cute and cuddly with- it never made sense to me really, but then, each to their own...

But then Clark had Lois......Clark: Superhero. Lois: Jane Normal. Clois: Happy. Hehe. :D
But I understand your POV. Buffy needs a stand-beside-her-in-a-demon-fight type. Maybe she'd be good with Dean off Supernatural.....hehe.

And yes, maybe I will have to check the vitamin thing. Haha. But I used to be the standoffish type. Well, in an emotional way anyway, but hubby drew me out (mostly through our early stage dating amusing arguments of America vs England. All in good fun of course) and now I think he regrets it due to how much I share with him. He's probably cursing himself now. Hahaha.

[Hello Cutie]

mostly through our early stage dating amusing arguments of America vs England. All in good fun of course.

Definitely England!!! :P

Although, had it been Astronauts vs Cave Men, I'm pretty sure a) you wouldnt have been arguing as much, and b) that cave men would have won!!

[Joyce Summers]

Definitely England!!! :P

Although, had it been Astronauts vs Cave Men, I'm pretty sure a) you wouldnt have been arguing as much, and b) that cave men would have won!!

See, he's English. I'm American. He arrived in America complaining his butt off. Obviously I converted him enough (he did marry me after all, haha). And I think if the argument had been Astronauts vs Cave Men we'd still be arguing actually! haha.

And man, we've gone off-topic....teehee