Gunn and Angel Investigations

[LadyLavinia]

Something has always bothered me. In mid-to-late Season 2, Cordelia, Wesley and Charles had decided to revive Angel Investigations. In the Season 3 episode, "This Old Gang of Mine", Charles had an encounter with his former street gang. Near the end of the episode, Wesley had threatened to fire Charles if the latter ever goes against AI again.

Here is the rub. Why in the hell would Wesley threatened to fire Charles? HE HAD NO RIGHT. Charles was no longer an employee of Angel Investigations. He was one of three partners. I realize that he and Cordelia had voted to allow Wesley act as leader in their cases. But this gave Wesley NO RIGHT to treat Charles as an employee, instead of a partner. He should have told Charles that he and Cordelia would break with Charles if the latter ever pulled again what he did in "This Gang of Mine". Instead, Wes treated Charles like a minion and that pissed me off. And no one protested against this.

[Dancing man]

It was anger in the heat of the moment.

[Kana]

Wesley had the same rights as Angel did when he headed up Angel Investigations. He actually stated that he was the boss when Wes said they were a team. Angel also said he was paying Gunn so that's why he should take orders. That makes Angel the employer and Gunn the employee (although in the episode Gunn stated that this was not a professional mission but a personal one). If Angel has employer's rights then Wes should too as he was the closest thing to a de jure employer around Season 2. Gunn was the employee, as was Cordy and Angel, Wes was the employer. If Angel had the right to fire the team, then Wes had the right to fire Gunn.

[LadyLavinia]

"Wesley had the same rights as Angel did when he headed up Angel Investigations. He actually stated that he was the boss when Wes said they were a team.

NO . . . he did not. Cordelia and Gunn had both agreed that Wesley should act as boss while working on cases. That DID NOT give Wesley the right to "fire" Charles, who was a partner of the firm. All Wesley had to do was threaten that he and Cordelia would cut out Charles, if the latter ever repeated his mistake. Which is what happened to Wesley by the middle of Season 3.

I'm just appalled that Wesley actually thought he had the right to treat Charles like some minion or mere employee. But I suspect that Wesley always harbored a superior attitude when it came to Charles.

[white avenger]

Well, if nothing else, it had great dramatic effect at the moment. Maybe when Gunn had a chance to think about it, he would have realized that Wesley had no real authority over him, but at that moment the threat served its purpose: it expressed Wes' displeasure in Gunn's actions and pointed out that his actions were wrong and they put the others in jeopardy.

[littlewilly]

I dont think when Wes said that to Gunn that he was being all high and mighty.
He probably felt quite awkward having to say something like that, ecspecially to Gunn. Wes and Gunn were good, close friends and always had a mutual respect for each other.
And maybe Gunn didnt say anything because he felt maybe Wes was right, that if he was going to be part of AI then it had to be 100% commitment and honesty from him.

[Kana]

NO . . . he did not. Cordelia and Gunn had both agreed that Wesley should act as boss while working on cases. That DID NOT give Wesley the right to "fire" Charles, who was a partner of the firm. All Wesley had to do was threaten that he and Cordelia would cut out Charles, if the latter ever repeated his mistake. Which is what happened to Wesley by the middle of Season 3.

I'm just appalled that Wesley actually thought he had the right to treat Charles like some minion or mere employee. But I suspect that Wesley always harbored a superior attitude when it came to Charles.

As far I as I can tell Wesley would have the same rights as Angel (if any). If Angel was the boss before then Wesley was the boss circa Season 2. Angel actually said that Wesley was in charge now, THEY WERE NOT PARTNERS. Gunn even referred to Wes as the boss as did Wes himself (Offspring). There was no mention of Wesley merely 'acting' as leader.

The issue of Wesley actually firing Charles? Well this is seperate issue. I partially agree that Wesley was doing it for effect, but it's more about him being about the big picture. Does he think the mission is more important than Gunn? I'd say yes but he'd think the same thing of himself. He was willing to have Faith risk his life to get Angelus so that many other lives will be saved. This is what Angel meant in Lineage when he said Wes is the guy who has to make all the hard decisions. As Gunn said in the very ep we're talking about, it's about the mission.

[LadyLavinia]

As far I as I can tell Wesley would have the same rights as Angel (if any). If Angel was the boss before then Wesley was the boss circa Season 2. Angel actually said that Wesley was in charge now, THEY WERE NOT PARTNERS. Gunn even referred to Wes as the boss as did Wes himself (Offspring). There was no mention of Wesley merely 'acting' as leader.


Wesley WAS NOT the goddamn founder of Angel Investigations II. Wesley, CHARLES and Cordelia were all the founders and partners of the second phase of the agency. They had all agreed that Wesley was to act as leader of the actual investigations.

I don't care if Wesley had been tagged as the one leading the investigations. What pissed me off was that the writers actually allowed Wesley threatened Charles with employment termination . . . as if Charles was his employer, instead of a partner of AI. WHICH HE WAS.

What I find even more disturbing is that many fans, along with the writers, seemed to think that Wesley HAD THE RIGHT to treat Charles in that manner. My question is . . . WHY? Especially since Charles, Cordelia and Wesley were all PARTNERS of Angel Investigations stpimf mid-to-late Season Two and early Season Three.

If the second phase of Angel Investigations had began as Wesley, Charles and Cordelia as co-founders . . . why on earth would anyone think that Wesley had the right to threaten Charles with job termination, as if the latter was a mere employee?

I keep asking this question numerous times and I have yet to read an answer that makes any sense. Instead, I'm reading excuses for Wes treating Charles like a damn minion.



"Instead of disbanding while Angel deals with his private issues, Gunn, Cordelia, and Wesley continue running AI without him in a rented office. They opt to keep the name "Angel Investigations" because they feel they are continuing the "mission" that Angel started out with. Eventually, Angel rejoins them and their base of operations returns to the Hyperion Hotel. As part of his amends, he agrees to work for them and Wesley is selected as the leader of the team."

In no way does this hint that Wesley was the one who solely founded Angel Investigations II.