Why do people say things like this:

[The Ferg]

Well, I just can't stand it when people say things like:

"I just can't stand this character. I never have liked him/her." or:
"I just hated whiny-Dawn in S5. She was so annoying. However she got better in S7." or:
"I'm so glad they changed him in S5! I couldn't stand him!"

It just makes me so mad! I don't hate any one character, and I don't absolutely love one character. Each character brings his/her own feel to the show. For example S5 wouldn't have been ANYTHING without Dawn, and S4 wouldn't have been anything without Riley. Why can't people just accept character the way they are. Ok, that sounds kidna corny, but seriously, why can't people just accept that Dawn is having social problems as a 15 year old within a pretty much 20 year old world. (referring to S6) Please post what your opinion is about this. And just because someone is "annoying" doesn't mean he/she shouldn't be there. Dawn and Riley were an integral part of the show (just examples).

[Cangel]

Well people are entitled to have their own opinion. So if they think so, just let them. As long as no one forces you to feel that way about something.
I'm used to people trashing my favourite characters and ships from time to time (esp Cangel), but hey, it doesn't change how I feel about it. If others hate something you think is/was great, their loss.

[InsaneMystic]

I guess that's just how human beings are, liking some people and disliking others? ???

Anyway, there's a difference I think between "I hate this-and-that character" and "this-and-that character should never have been in the show". E.g., I guess I'm already known here for severely disliking Joyce and thus, for my personal taste/enjoyment, feeling too much time was spent on the Joyce arc in S5. However, I would never say that any of that should "better have been left out", as I'm well aware how important Joyce's disease, OP and death were for the development of Buffy's character. Heck, even Riley, who was a total bore IMO, fulfilled a meaningful role in the storyline.

In fact, I'd even make a point saying that if a show manages to get you to really hate a character it must be doing something right (unless that hatred was totally unintended... remember Wesley Crusher in Trek?)... after all, hate means they hit home and got to you.

[The Ferg]

lol, you're post about The Body/Joyce was what drove me to make this thread.

Well, just like I was saying, why did you not like Joyce? Why in your opinion was Riley a bore?

[Joyce Summers]

I totally get what both you mean The Ferg, and what InsaneMystic said.
I mean, I already know InsaneMystic hates Joyce- we two members are like the opposite ends of the Joyce spectrum, haha, but it doesn't bother me. We agree to disagree. IM has reasons for hating Joyce and therefore not liking anything Joyce centric while I on the opposite side of things have reasons for loving Joyce and therefore loving anything Joyce centric. Except her death. Great but very upsetting....
So I think people can just hate characters because in a way it clashes with their own personality and tastes. I can't explain my hate for Kennedy. I just do. If she existed and I came across her in real life we would no doubt rub each other up the wrong way.

However The Ferg I agree with you about hating when people just say 'I hate this character. They were....' and it's just that simple statement. It's so 2D and we're talking about a polylayered show. I understand just hating a character but at least go past a statement of 'They are boring' or 'They are stupid'. For such an intelligent show such three word sentences are...well, disappointing.
Most on this board though are intelligent enough to go 'I can't stand [Name] because [Reason] even though [Reason they were integral]'- like InsaneMystic for example (I'm using you because you've posted on here, haha) may hate Joyce but will probably get that well, Buffy (and by extension the others) needed a Mom on the show so she's integral in that way and therefore, as mentioned, her S5 storyline was too.

So I guess what I'm trying to say is I don't mind people hating a character if the reasoning or understanding is intelligent and not....two-dimensional. Because then it gets frustrating. Haha

[LittleMissLikesToFight]

If everyone loved every character... or was even just "ok" with every character we wouldn't have too many interesting threads and discussions on this site, would we?

[InsaneMystic]

Can't really add much to what Joyce Summers (the other Joyce :wink: ) said.

I stare in disbelief too at, e.g. the anti-Tillow-faction, but if I hear reasons for their opinion I usually find myself able to "agree to disagree", even though I'll probably never understand their position.

My hatred for Joyce stems from my own problems with my real-life mum and Joyce's behaviour in "Becoming-Anne-DMP", where she just got me angrily spouting swearwords at the screen. I never managed to get over that.

And Riley... well I'm not the only one who thinks there was sadly distinct lack of Blucas-Gellar chemistry, and he just seemed so... well, two-dimensional, mundane and stiff. When he finally got a real dark side (vamp whores), it already was too late for him to get me interested in him. Storylinewise, he was definitely a fitting boyfriend for Buffy after Angel, but pretty much set up to fail from the beginning. And, well, so he did.
Plus, of course, he had the misfortune to be introduced in S4, the Season I always liked the least (and that, too, has a chunk of personal/biographic reasons with me, I guess).

[littlewilly]

Reilly didnt fit into the scoobies, he wasnt accepted the way Oz and Tara(eventually) were. But when have the scoobs ever accepted Buffys boyfriends. Shes a magnet for the wrong type of guy.

[The Ferg]

I totally get what both you mean The Ferg, and what InsaneMystic said.
I mean, I already know InsaneMystic hates Joyce- we two members are like the opposite ends of the Joyce spectrum, haha, but it doesn't bother me. We agree to disagree. IM has reasons for hating Joyce and therefore not liking anything Joyce centric while I on the opposite side of things have reasons for loving Joyce and therefore loving anything Joyce centric. Except her death. Great but very upsetting....
So I think people can just hate characters because in a way it clashes with their own personality and tastes. I can't explain my hate for Kennedy. I just do. If she existed and I came across her in real life we would no doubt rub each other up the wrong way.

However The Ferg I agree with you about hating when people just say 'I hate this character. They were....' and it's just that simple statement. It's so 2D and we're talking about a polylayered show. I understand just hating a character but at least go past a statement of 'They are boring' or 'They are stupid'. For such an intelligent show such three word sentences are...well, disappointing.
Most on this board though are intelligent enough to go 'I can't stand [Name] because [Reason] even though [Reason they were integral]'- like InsaneMystic for example (I'm using you because you've posted on here, haha) may hate Joyce but will probably get that well, Buffy (and by extension the others) needed a Mom on the show so she's integral in that way and therefore, as mentioned, her S5 storyline was too.

So I guess what I'm trying to say is I don't mind people hating a character if the reasoning or understanding is intelligent and not....two-dimensional. Because then it gets frustrating. Haha
Well, I guess I'm just the type of person that can't do that. I don't know, but to me it just sounds stupid for someone to hate a character for really their own personal reasons that no one else has. And like InsaneMystic said about Anti-Tillow fans, that's just ridiculous, I'm sorry. That was a beautful relationship, and... how can someone hate that?

[LittleMissLikesToFight]

i dont think its that people HATE it, they just dont love it? i dunno if that makes sense. im sort of indifferent to Tillow.

[Jenny]

It just makes me so mad! I don't hate any one character, and I don't absolutely love one character. Each character brings his/her own feel to the show. For example S5 wouldn't have been ANYTHING without Dawn, and S4 wouldn't have been anything without Riley. Why can't people just accept character the way they are.

You know, I agree with you to a point. I feel the same way. I do feel that there isn't any one character we could have 'lost' and had the show end up being quite so special. Every character adds a layer, an element, makes you feel...something. But that's just it. I did not like Kennedy. Would I want her to have been excluded - no, I feel she was integral to Willow's storyline. BUT if I hope into a thread talking about Kennedy (either good or bad) I would of course voice my opinion. Which is that I was not a Kennedy fan. So you make a good point, but at the same time we need to like or dislike certain characters to 'feel' them.

[VisionGuy]

Like real life, people are gonna be liked and disliked. I know there are a few characters in the Buffyverse that I dislike. But it's my personal opinion.

[Joyce Summers]

Originally posted by InsaneMystic
And Riley... well I'm not the only one who thinks there was sadly distinct lack of Blucas-Gellar chemistry, and he just seemed so... well, two-dimensional, mundane and stiff

See that's how I always felt about the Cordy/Angel relationship. I understood how it came about and why it had to happen, but while David and Charisma had great friendship chemistry for their characters, that same wonderful chemistry seemed to die in the face of romance so I could never get into that couple. So I guess you could say I don't like it, but- referring back to the point of this thread- it doesn't mean I can't appreciate it. Hating/Disliking doesn't mean...ignoring or venting. It just means...not your cup of tea.


Both Jenny and VisionGuy have said what I was basically trying to put across. I mean these characters are so well written and multi-dimensional that we're often allowed to forget that they are imaginary, we buy into the reality of them. So just like in reality we have people we like, people we immediately click with and people we just don't like for some unknown reason. For example you may find that you immediately clicked with Willow, liked/appreciated the Tillow relationship but for some reason unknown to you Tara always rubbed you up the wrong way.

[Rowan Hawthorn]

People aren't gonna like hearing this, either, but from hanging out on the 'net the last six or seven years, it appears to me that there are some viewers who seem to just jump onto any new "I hate so-and-so" bandwagon that comes along - like, it's the popular thing to hate on certain characters, so it's important that they get in line with the rest of the kewl kids.

[The Ferg]

Yeah, I totally agree with you. People tend to do that a lot.