Twlight: Love it... or Hate it?

[bufsum]

Forgive me if there's another one of these threads hiding somewhere... I didn't see one. Or, if it goes in another part of the boards... sorry!

I wanted to open this thread so that people can discuss their thoughts on the newest, and most popular vampire tale. Let me start off the discussion by saying I have yet to read the book (what a great way to begin a discussion, I know!). However, I am going to be reading it shortly, getting it from the library today, as a matter of fact!

I only know what my sister has told me about the series. She has read the first half of Twlight, and gave up. She cited a number of reasons for doing so. Mainly, she disliked the story, the characters, and Meyer's writing style. Reason enough to give up, I'd say.

The reason I am starting this thread is because of a comment made by her while we were discussing Twlight. She said, "I can't see how any fan of Joss Whedon could like that crap." She sees Edward Cullen as an abusive boyfriend to a cranky and unimaginative heroine Bella Swan, and the mythology lacking, and not connected to other vampire stories.

So... I wanted to know what all of you think of this series. Do you think that the series is "an antithesis to everything that Joss believes in" or do you really enjoy it?

[JCC]

I absolutely despise it. Killing literature.

[IHeartSpike]

I'm reading it at the moment actually!

I'm about 3/4's of the way through...and so far enjoying it. It is a decent read and would recommend to other people, but i wouldn't say it is the best I've ever read though.

[Spirit_Of_Fred]

i am a big fan of twilight and would definitely recommend it. i consider it kind of independent from buffy, though. its a totally different world (in terms of mystical) with totally different rules. i have met a lot of people who liked it, but also a couple who it bothered because they didnt like how the vampires and whatnot were different than in buffy. im sure there are good reasons not to like it, but personally, i think that it and buffy are just two seperate mythologies and wouldnt myself consider their contrast a good reason to dislike it.

basically, i disagree that its "an antithesis to everything that Joss believes in", but i can see how not liking the writing style and so forth is a good enough reason for your sister dislike it.

[Crazy Flakes]

As embarrassed as I am to admit it, I love Twilight. But, to be honest, you couldn't even compare it to Buffy (and this isn't because Buffy's a TV show and Twilight's not...in fact, I rarely think of Buffy as a TV show.) Buffy's characters all have incredible depth, flaws, and personalities personalities and the writing is fantastic. Twilight characters have little depth, flaws, and personality (Although I do have a huge fangirl crush on him, Edward is the definition of a Mary Sue...or would it be a Gary Stu?), and the characters are so difficult to grow attached to because of Stephenie Meyer's occasionally poor writing of them. I'm not sure how she's going to make Midnight Sun (Twilight from Edward's perspective) remotely interesting...after all, it's in the perspective of a character whose main trait is his utter perfection.

You can't have incredibly high expectations for Twilight, since it's just another young adult series written by a first-time author that hit it big. I, personally, find the series oddly addictive, even though it's incredibly cliched and completely unoriginal. I have to give her points for her unique take on vampires, though...plus, there are some very quotable lines from her books.

To put it simply, is Twilight enjoyable? Hell yes. Is Twilight good? No, not really.

[TheHeartist]

I read the first one...didn't like it, won't be reading the rest. It's a poor man's Vampire Chronicles, seriously, if you want an awesome ongoing mythology about vampire, read all the Vampire Chronicles! Anne Rice is an awesome novellist! :D

[JCC]

Anne Rice is just as hideous. I tend to hate vampire fiction anyway, but Anne Rice is awful.

[Tranquillity]

To put it simply, is Twilight enjoyable? Hell yes. Is Twilight good? No, not really.

That really does sum it up!
I've read all three books and will certainly read 'Breaking Dawn' when it comes out but i'm not pretending its great literature or anything. And really, it's written for a teenage audience - my fifteen year old and her friends are all mad about the books. I'm also looking forward to the movie.

I find Edward and Bella very Buffy and Angelesque because at it's heart the story is acctually a very traditional romance, that just happens to involve a vampire....
And i'm not someone who loves Bangel-type romance, so it surprised me that i enjoyed the books as much as i did and that Jacob, the Spike-like character really annoyed me alot, (which further annoyed me because I'm firmly a Buffy and Spike person and I felt I 'should' be going for the anti-romance romance - if that makes any sense).

[Aethra]

Truly awful, in my opinion. Nothing happened in the first 150 pages, so I stopped reading. Maybe it got better at 151--I don't know. But if it takes that long for anything to happen, in my opinion, I shouldn't bother with it.

[Randy Giles]

I think that Stephanie Meyer is a very talented writer. Her "Twilight" series is well-written, and her new sci-fi novel, "The Host", is even better. I find that Meyer is very good at creating good characters, because that's what immediately drew me to each of her novels: I liked the characters and how they were written.

Her style of writing is very addictive, so "Twilight" - which has a pretty basic plot - succeeds where I think most authors would fail. And when I started reading the book I was not expecting much, at all. I was very skeptical because vampire/mortal love stories aren't exactly uncommon...but I was very impressed, and think Meyer's success is well deserved.

[xaphania]

I personally love Twilight, but I can understand why some people would hate it.

I read the Twilight books before seeing any of Buffy, so for me it was the other way around - having become used to Meyer's vampire mythology I had to try and get my head around the Buffyverse vampire lore.

They're not the best written books, but the plot is engaging and the characters are likeable. I much prefer the idea of Bella/Jacob to Edward - I think he's far too controlling and possessive of Bella. I have no doubts in which direction Breaking Dawn will go, however.

[SpikedBuffy]

I go through spurts where I just absolutely LOVE them, have to read them all again, find myself thinking of Edward and Bella, and then other times, I'm like...eh.

I know a lot of people hate them because it doesn't get the correct history/lifestyle/blah/blah/blah about vampires. And I'm like... hello, it's Vampires. They're not freaking real anyway. duh. :)

[bufsum]

I have read Twlight (and have had life-stuff, so I haven't been able to post). I have to say, it was terribly misogynistic. I found Edward’s constant control over Bella horrid, especially because she continually gives into him. She puts up a bit of a fight, but gives up every time. She also has major self esteem issues that are never confronted. Mostly I find her to be a brat, who acts like she’s 25. She acts as if all other humans are daft idiots, and the only people she deems good enough to relate to are the vampires.

Furthermore, Meyer is setting up a disgusting display of how relationships should be for the tweens to whom the book is directed to. I can only assume that there are hundreds of young girls wondering around, searching for their own Edward, to control them. Ach!

If this wasn’t enough I find the writing style deplorable. It was obviously written for young girls (as I stated above), but I have been spoiled by Harry Potter, I expect to enjoy a rich tapestry woven together for me to enjoy with a literary eye. I found myself talking to the pages, correcting errors, and coming up with better ways to connect events that seemed haphazardly thrown together.

And one last thing—rip off! I am sorry, but how could you read this, and not see similarities between the series and other popular culture. For example, I saw Edward, Alice, Jasper, Emmett, and Rosalie as the aliens in Roswell. Edward=Max/Zan, Alice=Isabel/Volandra, Emmett=Michael/Wrath, and Rosalie (at least in this book) reminded me of Tess/Ava. I saw elements in the book that were stolen from The X Files, as well. Let’s not forget the fact that Edward and Bella are obviously supposed to be Buffy and Angel.

I have no problem with “borrowing” from other texts, but be a woman… and own up to it! All in all, no thank you, Meyer.

[JCC]

I have read Twlight (and have had life-stuff, so I haven't been able to post). I have to say, it was terribly misogynistic. I found Edward’s constant control over Bella horrid, especially because she continually gives into him. She puts up a bit of a fight, but gives up every time. She also has major self esteem issues that are never confronted. Mostly I find her to be a brat, who acts like she’s 25. She acts as if all other humans are daft idiots, and the only people she deems good enough to relate to are the vampires.

Furthermore, Meyer is setting up a disgusting display of how relationships should be for the tweens to whom the book is directed to. I can only assume that there are hundreds of young girls wondering around, searching for their own Edward, to control them. Ach!

If this wasn’t enough I find the writing style deplorable. It was obviously written for young girls (as I stated above), but I have been spoiled by Harry Potter, I expect to enjoy a rich tapestry woven together for me to enjoy with a literary eye. I found myself talking to the pages, correcting errors, and coming up with better ways to connect events that seemed haphazardly thrown together.

And one last thing—rip off! I am sorry, but how could you read this, and not see similarities between the series and other popular culture. For example, I saw Edward, Alice, Jasper, Emmett, and Rosalie as the aliens in Roswell. Edward=Max/Zan, Alice=Isabel/Volandra, Emmett=Michael/Wrath, and Rosalie (at least in this book) reminded me of Tess/Ava. I saw elements in the book that were stolen from The X Files, as well. Let’s not forget the fact that Edward and Bella are obviously supposed to be Buffy and Angel.

I have no problem with “borrowing” from other texts, but be a woman… and own up to it! All in all, no thank you, Meyer.
When Harry Potter is deemed superbly literate in comparison to something, you know that something is not worthy of existence.

[palabravampiress]

I read Twilight cuz I wanted to see what all the fuss was about.

I read it all the way through, but that's the best thing I can say for it. I felt like it needed... more, umm, everything. It just needed more.

First off, I found the love story absurd and insipid. I wasn't entirely sure what either character saw in the other that was likeable, let alone loveable. The "love" business just seemed to come out of nowhere as a result of prolonged and continued association with one another. I got the impression that had Bella sat next to some other good looking boy in biology class, the hormone parade set into motion by the video days would have continued in much the same manner no matter who the boy was. And, yes, I found Edward waaay too controlling. His love was all about staying away from her and not letting her know about his affection for her (half of which was a desire to eat her)... until he proved too weak to do that and put her in danger as a result, all of which is somehow supposed to make me see his inherent perfection. As far as Bella goes, she is a spoiled brat who has no greater purpose in life than to... date and talk down to her peers and even parents, all of whom are apparently incapable of functioning without her? Come on! The bad vamp coven (or, alternatively, the feud with the werewolves) should have been the main story from the beginning, with the Edward/Bella love story being carefully folded and layered into that so that the experience bonded them. Instead, the love story takes center stage for 3/4 of the book until an action-packed climax is required, at which point rival vamps are brought in totally by accident. I had a very hard time feeling invested in the main plot, every aspect of which seemed haphazardly thrown together.

I found my mind constantly wandering to events and characters that existed on the periphery. I wanted to know more about Jacob Black and the other werewolves. I thought the uneasy truce between the Cullens family and the Native Americans could have been really neat. Meyer missed the boat by mentioning it, but going nowhere with it. I found the makeup of Edward's family and their backstory very interesting, but Meyer missed THAT boat by making them all too perfect. I liked the fact that Bella was incredibly clumsy. I thought we were heading toward something with that... like maybe she was some sort of mythical creature or hybrid or at least handicapped or something. But no. Meyer never explained that at all. Instead, it was just a transparent -- and failed -- attempt to give the character obligatory flaws without really damaging her. I wanted to know more about the parents (and why they acted so infantile). These are by and large the things that kept me reading -- and also the things that were just dropped in, then conveniently forgotten in order to go even more ridiculously heavy-handed with the misogynistic teen love story.

So, yeah. I'm not a fan. Can you tell? This was Buffy light -- waaay too light -- and minus the feminism.

[SpikedBuffy]

palabra~ Have you read the second book? New Moon? You'll get more Native American/Jacob Black interaction there, and see their interaction with the Cullens. Even some of that in the third book, Eclipse.

I do like these books. They're just entertainment for me. Not literary masterpieces, and something that I read to get the meaning of life. Just reading. Just fun.

[Yam Sham]

Here's New Moon in a nutshell:
Linked for cussing! (http://i248.photobucket.com/albums/gg165/MiraclexBlazer/newmoon-1.jpg)


Twilight books are enjoyable and addictive, and yet so ridiculous and horrible at the same time. They're so incredibly cheesy and stupid, but I love 'em.

[Kryptonite]

I have read Twlight (and have had life-stuff, so I haven't been able to post). I have to say, it was terribly misogynistic...

In what way? The entire story is written and narrated by a woman! Misogynistic is a very strong word if you're just going to reference your statement that Edward "controls" Bella.

I found Edward’s constant control over Bella horrid, especially because she continually gives into him. She puts up a bit of a fight, but gives up every time.

Examples?

She also has major self esteem issues that are never confronted.

Like how she finds herself as ordinary and plain? I'm pretty sure that describes 90% of the teenage girls I've ever met. Would you prefer a character without self esteem issues?

Furthermore, Meyer is setting up a disgusting display of how relationships should be for the tweens to whom the book is directed to....

I can only assume that there are hundreds of young girls wondering around, searching for their own Edward, to control them.

Are you going to criticize every book that has a controlling character in it? Every book that has a relationship that teenagers shouldn't model their relationships after?

This book is fake.

I've never seen anywhere or heard at anytime Stephenie Meyer say that she thinks this is the way that relationships are supposed to be and that she hopes everyone finds someone just like Edward.

To dismiss a book because the relationships are not realistic is ignorant.

Let’s not forget the fact that Edward and Bella are obviously supposed to be Buffy and Angel.

Like Buffy and Angel are supposed to be Romeo and Juliet? Oh wait, like Romeo and Juliet are supposed to Tristan and Isolde?

[edb]

I seem to have come across alot of people raving about this series and I have to admit to being intrigued as they are all so excited about the upcoming Twilight movie too. Having read some of your comments I'm now in two minds whether to read them or not..........

It seems you either love Twilight or you don't.

[SpikedBuffy]

I would say if you've got the time, you should read them. If you get through the first one (which in my opinion is the better of all three) and you don't like it, then you can move on. It's not going to kill you to either read them or quit reading them if you don't like them. You just have to see for yourself.

I am excited for the movie slightly. I hate when movies are 'based' off of books. Really, I think they should say "We took the title of this books and a few of the characters and then screwed it up beyond belief and you will definitely hate it because you have the whole book memorized and it will be nothing like you envisioned in your head because we suck as scriptwriters."

[littlewilly]

Ì'll keep it short and sweet. Twilights craply pathetic. Darth Wanker, End of magic. what. Running out of ideas Joss.

[edb]

I would say if you've got the time, you should read them. If you get through the first one (which in my opinion is the better of all three) and you don't like it, then you can move on. It's not going to kill you to either read them or quit reading them if you don't like them. You just have to see for yourself.

You see the people who I know who love the Twilight series, well, we read/watch the same things - mostly it's the people I know via their fanart sites so I think I probably will give it a whirl. :)

[Cangel]

I hate it. Seriously, I'm all for romance and everything, but this book was just taking it to far into kitsch.
At the beginning I actually liked it, like when she was trying to find out what his deal was, but then when she knew he was a vampire it just went down so badly.

[~angelic slayer~]

My friend recommended it to me a few months ago, and I considered reading it (figured, what the heck!). But after not being able to find it at the local libraries I was a little discouraged, and now that they have made a movie production of it I'm more hesitant than ever :silly:

It seems like a great story, but I've heard a lot of "it's a repeat of Buffy/Angel"-- which I think would really ruin the book for me! I'm really debating whether I should just leave it be and hate it with a passion for the bangel factor, or actually read it before I make a decision.

We'll have to see, I suppose I should make an informed decision though!

[SpikedBuffy]

It is nothing like Buffy/Angel. Just like someone said before, would you compare Romeo and Juliet to Buffy and Angel? Um, no, because they are totally different characters in different worlds. Any media that has two unsuspecting people fall in love when they clearly shouldn't is not a knock-off of Buffy and Angel. These stories of unrequited love were being written way before the 'romance' of Buffy and Angel was created.

The world created by Meyer in these books is nothing like the vampire world we saw on Buffy. It is 100% different.

[Crazy Flakes]

I can definitely see where the Buffy/Angel and Edward/Bella comparisons come from. They both have the whole vampire-human forbidden romance thing going on, they both include a "good" vampire that doesn't want to be a monster, they both leave their human girlfriends to protect them (except Edward comes back and Angel doesn't.)...I could go on. I even found an Edward/Bella video that uses clips of Buffy and Angel (which you can watch here (http://youtube.com/watch?v=dn2cuMEBugo); but, just a warning, spoilers may follow if you haven't read the entire Twilight series.)

They're similar at the heart, but overall, they're very different. I think there are two main differences; the first is the whole power issue. In Buffy and Angel's case, they both appear to be about equal in strength (although it has been suggested that Buffy is a little bit stronger.) In Edward and Bella's case, Edward is super strong and Bella's not; the fact that Edward has to constantly make sure he won't accidentally kill her plays into the whole "forbidden" aspect of their romance. *MAJOR SPOILERS WILL FOLLOW IN THIS NEXT PARAGRAPH, SO BEWARE!*

The second is the fact that Edward and Bella's relationship comes off as a more "eternal" love. Edward plans to turn Bella into a vampire so that they can be together forever, because in Edward's world, being a vampire isn't that bad...he has a whole family of good vampires that both he and Bella know, trust, and love. More importantly, after she's "turned," she's just the same person she was as a human only in vampiric form. In Angel's case, turning Buffy into a vampire is unheard of. Unlike Edward, as far as he and Buffy know, he's the only good vampire in the world. But the main problem is that Buffyverse vamps are, as Spike puts it, "evil, soulless things." She couldn't just learn how to be a good vampire like Bella can.

There are a lot of other, smaller differences, too (Edward finds Bella's blood more appealing than anyone else's, Bella's life doesn't circulate around killing vampires, Edward doesn't have the whole 'losing his soul' issue, Buffy's life wasn't normal before Angel came into the picture, etc.), but the former two are the biggies. Overall, I think I like Buffy and Angel's relationship more, mainly because Edward and Bella don't have enough flaws. Plus, it annoys me how Edward pretty much takes over Bella's life after they get together.

[SpikedBuffy]

Is anyone totally obsessed over waiting until December until the movie comes out? I'm freaking out, because it feels like it's going to take forever.

[palabravampiress]

I am revising my opinion. I'm still not in love with the series, but I read New Moon and am halfway through Eclipse and I've gotta say... it gets better. New Moon addresses the questions I had about the werewolves and even some of the questions about the vampires. Eclipse is delving further into both, as well. No word yet on why the parents are so infantile, but whatever. In these books, I see a new author slowly gaining the confidence to take more risks. She's getting better. I still hate Edward, though, and have no idea why anyone would ever like him. So far, the best thing even Edward fans can say is that he's physically attractive and that he loves her. When I bring up his control issues, (Hello! He BROKE her car so that she couldn't go visit a friend of whom he disapproves. He even paid his sister to KIDNAP Bella!) they shrug it off or see it as proof of his love. Why do people think overbearing, controlling, patronizing men = romance? Ugh!

That said, it's fun to have the Team Jacob/Team Edward debate at work. We're considering printing tee-shirts. I'm Team Jacob, in case anyone's wondering. Jacob has a personality, does FUN things with Bella, and doesn't lie to keep her safe or act like he's her prison warden.

[Lily]

I'm still on the fence about Team Edward/Jocob, although i think I might be leaing onto Edwards side just a little bit more.

I actually really enjoyed the books (and might have Breaking Dawn pre-ordered) so I struggle to see why just because it's vampire/human love story, it has to be compared to Buffy and Angel's love story(who I love, and would love to make the whole universe be all about them, but alas, it's not).

I like them purely as a work of fiction - if you want to get used to Stephanie Meyer's writing style befoer getting into the Twilight fandom of love/hate, I'd say read The Host first (plus it's a little bit more grown up) and then once you like that, read the Twilight series

[xgirlanachronism245x]

I read the first book, and won't be reading the rest of them. It's just not my style of vampire fiction. Personally, Anne Rice does it for me.
Meyer's writing style is a far cry from what I'm used to, and the roles her characters fall into seem a little forced... leaning towards an unrealistic love story falling downhill from when Bella discovers who Edward really is.
Of course, I was constantly comparing this book to vampire novels I've already read and to Buffy, and honestly, what can live up to those standards? Not a thing.

I recently went to the Anne Rice Vampire Ball in New Orleans with my school newspaper pass and interviewed a few people about vampire novels, other than the beloved Rice novels, they've read and enjoyed. I was not at all surprised to here Twilight and the following books didn't make the list.

Ah, but some people love them, especially the girls trapsing around my school.
More power to them... but I'll keep Lestat or my Angel warm... or cold... in bed with me thank you! =]


Like Buffy and Angel are supposed to be Romeo and Juliet? Oh wait, like Romeo and Juliet are supposed to Tristan and Isolde?

Hahahaha. Too true. Love story deja vu.

[SpikedBuffy]

It really is true. You love it. Or you hate it.

:)

As everyone knows, I LOVE it. I'm bouncing around the house right now, waiting for August 2. And then waiting for the movie.
But, I know that I tried to get my Grandma to read it, and she couldn't get past the third chapter. She hated it. I got my Mom to read it though, and she loved it like me.

But that's just the way it goes. Personally, I've never read an Anne Rice novel and have no desire to. And if I ever did, I may or may not hate it. You just never know.

[Kryptonite]

Are you going to a midnight release party?

[Crazy Flakes]

Are you going to a midnight release party?

I wanted to, but I couldn't find any locations that were hosting them in my area :( I pre-ordered Breaking Dawn on Amazon, though, so I don't have to worry about my local Barnes & Noble running out. I'm both excited and worried, 'cause the quotes of the day are pretty good so far (you can find them on stepheniemeyer.com), but I'm fairly certain it won't meet our expectations.

By the way, have you guys seen the new movie trailer?

YouTube - Official Twilight Teaser Trailer 2 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PCHbGig30GM)

Robert's still not my perfect Edward, but from what I've seen, he looks like he's going to do okay. I also had my suspicions about an African American guy playing Laurent (even though he's not a MAJOR part), but he, too, seems like he'll do a good job.

Aside from the reassurance about them, I did NOT like what I saw in this trailer. First off, Kristen's delivery at the very beginning was just awful. I can only hope that they just chose a bad moment to show off her acting. Then, there's the whole thing with the absence of the other Cullens. But my main problem with the trailer? "You brought a snack!" Cam's delivery was okay, but that writing is absolutely atrocious! I can't believe it's supposed to be creepy! *slaps forehead*

[Kryptonite]

I have to admit that I was all geeked after watching the trailer. I know full well that this movie isn't going to be like the book, but its purely the fact (for me) that, for the first time since Buffy, something I'm obsessed about has gotten real recognition. The actors aren't the characters, the lines aren't all right, and a lot of it has been completely changed, but my favorite book is being made into a movie.

I've never been a huge Harry Potter fan, so this is a big deal to me. :D






Edit:

Also, I'm under the suspicion that her parents find out that they're vampires. The quotes seem to imply that...unless, of course, that's their intention...


And on the trailer, the part where they are in the car and Edward pulls his hand away. That face he makes just nails the Edward I had in my head.

[SpikedBuffy]

And on the trailer, the part where they are in the car and Edward pulls his hand away. That face he makes just nails the Edward I had in my head.

I agree. That look in the car after their hands touch is totally Edward. When I watch trailers, sometimes I think "Ugh... he is so not Edward" and then other times, I feel like he totally is Edward.

I'm going to the release party. I'm very excited about it!

I've also rented the movie Penelope, because at the beginning they have a little part about Twilight. Have you seen it? It shows them filming a bit, and then you get to see a little bit of scene... it's nice.

[Kryptonite]

I know I YouTubed it because I don't care to watch Penelope, but I don't remember exactly what it was. I've watched so many clips so many times! Is it the clip where they're filming at the field trip and she asks how he stops the van?


ps. I know I've said this before but I'm so Team Jacob. Not necessarily because I think Bella should be with him. It's more because I should be with him...

[SpikedBuffy]

The penelope scene is Bella and Edward going to his house for the first time. He shows her his room and they dance.

[Crazy Flakes]

Yeah, I just saw the Penelope scene. I never thought I'd say this, but I'm really liking what I'm seeing of Rob! Still not entirely sure about Kristen, though...she just doesn't seem ordinary enough to play Bella. *shrugs*

Also, there's a new interview with Stephenie at Comic-Con (you can see it here (http://www.ew.com/ew/video/festivals?lineupId=1683773559&videoId=1688292813)), and it seems like she's pretty confident with what she wrote in Breaking Dawn. But there was one reason why I loved this interview...in part 4, when she's asked where she wanted to go in Comic-Con, guess what her immediate answer was? Joss Whedon's Dr. Horrible booth! Do you suppose she's watched Buffy and Angel since she first wrote Twilight, just to see what all the hubub was about, and became a fan? I sure hope so, 'cause it would be two of my favorite things colliding!

[SpikedBuffy]

Yeah, I just saw the Penelope scene. I never thought I'd say this, but I'm really liking what I'm seeing of Rob! Still not entirely sure about Kristen, though...she just doesn't seem ordinary enough to play Bella. *shrugs*


I'm definitely agreeing with you here. I have never really liked Kristen Stewart, she just comes off as whiny to me. Not at all what I expected Bella to be like.

But Rob... I think he actually tried to really become the character, and most of the time, I see Edward. So, I'm thinking I might not be too disappointed in the movie!

[palabravampiress]

Okay... so first off, the Breaking Dawn prom at my bookstore last night was way cute. I wore a dress, made an appearance, left to go get some food, then returned for my book at midnight. It was neat to see so many kids getting into it and enjoying reading. There were a lot of different age groups and a lot of different cliques present. Also, some of the dresses that the kids wore were way cute. Best of all, some of the more confident kids actually got up on the stage and danced. I am, like Bella, inept in all things requiring coordination and (unlike Bella) currently still in a brace and hobbling around with a crutch, so I was rendered totally jealous by watching those kids dance. It was fun, though. They were good dancers.

Anywho, so far, I really like Breaking Dawn. I feel like the conflict is arising more naturally from the characters and events in the series, now. I do question Meyer's decision to change her POV in Book 2, though. It seems like a radical departure from the previous books. Not that I mind being in Jacob's head. I like that kid. Still, I hope it doesn't mean that Meyer is losing her grasp on her main character.

[SpikedBuffy]

I am actually liking Jacob in this book....

This story did not turn out how I thought it would. I'm not finished yet, but it's been a wild ride so far. I'm not 100% sure I really like this one, compared to the other three. I'm not sure.

[palabravampiress]

^ Hmmm. I'm on page 261, and so far, it's my favorite. I like how alliances are being split and rearranged and whatnot -- and not necessarily along the easiest or most predictable lines. I also really like the cover art. It's really sort of fabulous for this story and for the subject matter.


Oh, and for once, I am not so much liking Edward, but I do feel sympathy for the guy. He is definitely a more sympathetic character in this one. It even sort of makes his earlier excesses seem... I don't know... somehow less icky given the fact that his worst nightmares for Bella are pretty much becoming true -- and it's his fault, no less. For the first time, I really genuinely feel for the guy.

[Lizzierainbow]

i ahve never read any of the twighlight books but my friends ahve read them and say that they are brilliant

[palabravampiress]

Well, I wouldn't go so far as to say "brilliant." I think Twilight is bad, New Moon is decent leaning toward good, Eclipse is decent, and Breaking Dawn is good.

To be fair, I was a Creative Writing major, so my standards are ridiculously high. Shakespeare was brilliant. Poe. Austen. Alcott. Whedon. Meyer hasn't made my list yet. :-)

[Crazy Flakes]

^ I agree with what you've said about Stephenie's writing...she's definitely not the best writer in the world, but I have to say, she is a good storyteller. That's why her books are so damn addicting.

Anyway, I've heard so many people talking about how much they hated Breaking Dawn, but I'm on page 455, and I think it's my favorite book in the series. Here are my thoughts so far (and the tags are there for a reason, so be wary if you haven't finished it yet...)

The wedding scene was so cute! Alice is the best, and it was great seeing her freaking out about everything.

I thought that pregnant Bella was a nice twist! Stupidly enough, I read spoilers first, so I saw it coming, but it was still kind of surprising. And, even though I thought I'd hate reading in Jacob's perspective, I rather liked it. I especially loved his interaction with Quil...love that guy!

So far, I'm liking vampire Bella WAAAAY more than human Bella. It was cool reading in a vamp's perspective instead of a boring human's, and her excitement about being stronger and faster than Edward made me smile. I'm guessing her special power is extreme self control, but maybe she'll develop some new ability because that's kind of boring. *le shrug* And I'm very curious to find out what the Volturi think about all these shenanigans.

My only problem with the book so far is the baby herself. I kind of wish Stephenie had watched Angel to see that the whole half human, half vampire baby plotline, though interesting at first, eventually leads to annoyingness. Seriously, RENESMEE?! What the hell was she smoking when she thought of that name?! I like Jake's nickname (Nessie) better. And the whole scene with Vampire Bella meeting her for the first time, then finding out Jake imprinted on her reads like bad fan fiction. I hope that's the low point of the book, because everything before that scene was great and I haven't read past it.

Also, I don't understand why everyone is freaking out about Jacob imprinting on Renesmee (the name still pisses me off! ARGH!). When Quil imprinted on a baby, nobody made a big deal. It's what werewolves in the Twilight universe do! You didn't see uproar across the country when Spike tasted his own nose blood on Buffy. And even worse, some people are talking about how they thought it was weird when Bella drank blood. Again, THAT'S WHAT VAMPIRES DO, YOU WANTED BELLA TO BE A VAMPIRE, NOW GET OVER IT. Haters to the left, please!

That said, I'm gonna go keep reading because the book is staring at me and begging me to pick it up again.

[Tranquillity]

Crazy Flakes!! that blacked out spoiler you've posted above is majorly tempting! We don't get the book here in Australia till Monday (tomorrow). I'm trying to control my temptation to look.....

[Crazy Flakes]

I just finished it up, and I have a lot of thoughts. Again, spoiler tags are there for a reason. So sorry, Tranquility!

Okay, so Bella meeting Nessie for the first time and finding out Jacob imprinted on her was definitely the turning point of the book. Before that, the book was very good; easily the best of the series; and after, large parts of it read like, as I previously mentioned, bad fan fiction. The whole thing with Nessie the rapidly-maturing super baby was just weird, to be honest. As for her special power, well, Stephenie just took that from The Giver (do you think that was the second book she was inspired by for this one? She said that she was influenced by A Midsummer Night's Dream and another one that she wouldn't reveal, so I figured it MUST be The Giver.)

After a little while, I found myself growing bored with Bella's interaction with the other Cullens. I guess that's just because everything revolved around Nessie and the other clans, and they were the two low points of the book. Speaking of which, I did NOT like the other vampires that visited; the only ones I didn't mind were Tanya and Kate, while the rest were just taking up space and writing. They were kind of like the Potentials on Buffy. Alice and Jasper's absence didn't help much, either; they're my favorite characters.

I did like Bella's interaction with the other characters, though...her scenes with Charlie and the other humans were more enjoyable because they actually talked about things besides Nessie and the other vampires' special powers. And I wish we'd seen Jasper and Alice's meetings with J. Jenks...I wanna know what happened there.

The ending left SO much to be desired. I wish I could complain and say that Stephenie was too risky; she wasn't being risky enough! She was clearly just giving the fans what they wanted (a happy ending for Edward and Bella, Jacob imprinting on someone else, yadda yadda yadda.) And could the "battle" with the Volturi have been more anticlimactic? It went like this:

Jane: GASP! Why aren't our powers working on them?
Aro: It must be Bella, the super perfect vampire!
Bella: Mwahahahaha! You can never break my shield!
All non-Volturi vampires: BELLA, YOU'RE THE BEST! YOU'RE PERFECT AND SPARKLY AND WE ALL LOVE YOU!
Edward: Let's have lots of off-screen sex!

...if you didn't notice, yes, I definitely think Bella needs more flaws. I was hoping she'd become more flawed when she became a vampire, what with the bloodlust, but I was wrong. I still think that Bella was much more likable as a vampire than as a human, but that doesn't change the fact that she's a static, flawless character who needs to be toned down a few notches. I wish Stephenie had her kill someone just so she could have SOMETHING wrong with her.

Okay, back to my annoyance with the ending. What was the deal with that? I think it would've been much better if the Volturi had actually taken Nessie. Okay, fine, it would depress the teenie-bopper fans that just want to have Bella and Edward have a perfect happy ending, but it would have been a good closing statement and it definitely would have allowed for a lot of much-needed character development for Bella and Edward. Or maybe I've been watching too many Joss Whedon shows.

Overall? I absolutely loved the first 450 pages or so, but after that, I was completely disappointed. Meh, oh well. At least they got a happy ending, right?

[SpikedBuffy]

I'm still in the air. I'll have to read it again to make a decision on if I like it. I'm on the borderline. There's so much crap in it that makes me want to put it on the bookshelf and never read it again. But then, there's a lot in it that felt right and worked really well with the story. I just don't know.

I was disappointed with one aspect though. The first three books were about the relationship between Bella and Edward, and how they treat each other and want to be together. But then this tale comes along and I felt like their relationship was not only left on the back burner, but the flame was turned off and it had started to get one of those gross skins on top of it that you get with soup. It was a fail there. All we got was the wedding, and that wasn't even really all that good. I understand and respect the fact that it was a teen book and there weren't going to be explicit descriptions of their first night together, but we didn't even get a fuzzy account. Just wham bam, oh yeah they must've had sex because Belle is somehow pregnant (and is planning on naming her child some ridiculous name that I stumbled across every single time I saw it in the print, because it was terrible.) But we didn't get to experience that romance of being on your honeymoon, which is something that both of the characters had been waiting for from the beginning of their relationship. Okay, end!

[Tranquillity]

Just finished Breaking Dawn.

like most of the above posters - was quite disappointed. I agree with everything you said ^^ Crazy Flakes (except i didn't enjoy the first half of the book). I Like more risk taking in my fiction. The characters got boring because nothing happened! The ending sucked!! And I agree with you SpikedBuffy (^) about that name. I think I pronounced it a different way every time I read it and never failed to think it was utterly ridiculous - even the nickname was stupid.

[palabravampiress]

I agree with a lot of what has been written above. The first 450 pages or so were probably the best of the entire series, minus a little bit of boring/over-the-top romantic stuff in the very beginning.

To be honest, I'm not all about the romance. I tend to prefer my vampires with some teeth. I like it when they fight. I like it when they're evil (or at least formerly evil). That being the case, I thought the playing down of the honeymoon romance was cool. I didn't need a bunch more sugary sweetness. I thought the sexual subject matter was handled well in general. I don't mind a good fade-to-black scene, either, and I liked reading that waaay more than the graphic details. Of course... I do think the ripping apart the bedframe thing was a little silly. Also, not sure if I would have chosen THE OCEAN for my first time, even though they did apparently make it inside to the bedroom at some point. Not sure what Meyer was thinking, there. Maybe it's that she didn't plan to describe it? Because I'm thinking sand and salt water in all the wrong places, here. Plus, I'd be scared of all the things that live in the ocean. Like stinging jellyfish. It SOUNDS plenty romantic until you think about it, then it sounds all uncomfortable and not-too-pleasant. Anyway, after all of that, I was glad Bella got pregnant so that there was a point to the silly sexual shenanigans.

As I mentioned earlier, I loved how the baby divided people and brought them together in interesting ways. I love how Edward's guilt made him a more sympathetic character. The pregnancy was a neat idea. Vampire Bella was fun. The Volturi being mad about it was a great idea. Up to this point, Meyer's descriptions were all very visceral, which I loved. But Nessie was annoyingly perfect, then Edward sort of became a back burner character as soon as I finally became interested in him, and the Jacob/Bella thing was resolved WAY too easily. Bella lacked the bloodlust, which was annoying because, as others have said, she needed some flaws. Finally, they got everyone together for this great big fight, and then they just talked for freakin' ever. Grr. I waited the whole book for a fight! In general, my problem with Breaking Dawn is the same problem I've had with the rest of the series: Meyer always backs off from the risk. She builds us up for it, but then things are resolved too neatly. I think we need to see some animosity or some evil with consequences. I think we need to see some conflict that comes from within, not always externally from the "bad" vampires. And for goodness' sake, could someone PLEASE drink some human blood?

So, basically, my opinion is in line with the rest: I liked the first 450 pages or so, but hated the end.

[Buffanator]

I have heard so much about these books - some of it good, some bad, & some super-praising, while others were knocking it hard.

I haven't read any of SM's work. I barely started reading one of Anne Rice's novels, when a friend said "Oh NO NO NO! - you have to read *blahblahblah* first, & then *blahblah* & THEN read the book you have." Phhhhhht. So I didn't read any of them. (yet... but I do have 4 Anne Rice novels, ready to be read when I feel like it.)

The bottom line for me is that if it doesn't compare to WhedonVerse, to the Buffy/Angel characters, etc. then I'm pretty much gonna be disappointed. HOWEVER... I did look at that Twilight trailer on youtube, & it looks to be a pretty good movie. Possibly since I haven't READ the book, I might see the movie. But then again, Walmart has the book on sale for $8.88 & I recently got "birthday money" to spend. :biggrin:

I did enjoy Interview with a Vampire movie, but then again, haven't read the book.

I did enjoy the Blade Trilogy, and I loved Bram Stoker's Dracula (w/Gary Oldman). And the campy Lost Boys is one of my favorite 80's movies.

Yet, still, I'm just not totally sold on this whole Twilight series thing. Could be because it's aimed at teenage girls. But WTF, so was Buffy. ;)

[Tranquillity]

I'm a librarian in a girls school and these books do a huge turn over; no sooner has one been returned and it is borrowed again. Needless to say we have multiple copies of each. I have taken to slipping a little piece of paper in the back saying:

If you enjoyed this book (or even if you didn't) you should check out the television series 'Buffy the Vampire Slayer'. it is sooooo much better!

I keep a little stash of them printed up so they are always on hand and ready to slip in when one of the books comes into the returns box. Just doing my bit to convert the lost to the B'verse :)

[SpikedBuffy]

Not to seem mean here, but I, personally am getting really tired of people comparing these books to the buffyverse. It's like comparing apples and oranges. They are not the same! I mean, there are always elements in stories that are similiar. If you're going to write a book about vampires, you have to borrow from the mythology. If you're going to write a book about mermaids, you're going to have to borrow from the mythology, but you certainly wouldn't be thinking... "Hmm, how can I make people compare my story to "The Little Mermaid?"

Seriously. It is possible to like the buffyverse, which is surely iconic, but in the past, and to like the Twilight series which may be hack and fluff, but right now in the present. And heck, you can even like the future vampire stories that may be exceptional or crappy, but it's okay! :)

[JCC]

For those who haven't read the book, this blog explains in detail the plot.

I swear to God all of that stuff actually happens.

shinga: Twilight! 1 (http://shinga.livejournal.com/478415.html)

[Blondie Bear]

I am heartily resisting reading these books (it's actually not as hard as resisting Harry Potter was, amazingly enough--none of my friends are reading these, that I know of), mostly because I avoid overly-popular gravy trains that are mostly populated by screaming preteen girls.