Dawn's Self-Cutting, WHY??

[InLoveWithBuffy]

When Dawn heared that she is The Key, why she self-cutted herself with a knife? I know that when i used to cut myself it made me feel litle bit better, but why Dawn did this? Why she felt so bad for being The Key? Can someone explain this?

[Kemy]

Same here, but whereas with us it was depressive, Dawn had just learned she wasn't real and mentally was unable to really deal with it, she did what she thought would prove it, do something that a "real person" would be harmed by, and she was.

She thought if she could see blood it would mean she was real, like the old joke, if you think you're asleep pinch yourself, it'll only hurt if you're awake.

[Lindsey McDonald]

I don't think it was to make herself feel better as much as it was to try and prove to herself and the others that she was real. If she bleeds like any other person when she is cut, then she must be human. Don't think it convinced her though. It also helped establish the "Summer's blood" thing.

[InLoveWithBuffy]

Yeah.... Maybe.... How would Buffy react if she would be in Dawn's position?

[Lindsey McDonald]

Well, Buffy's already dealt with being the chosen one, so I don't think she would have been quite so freaked. She would have felt even more isolated though, and I doubt she would have coped with the events of "The Body".

[InLoveWithBuffy]

I don't think it was to make herself feel better as much as it was to try and prove to herself and the others that she was real. If she bleeds like any other person when she is cut, then she must be human. Don't think it convinced her though. It also helped establish the "Summer's blood" thing.

And maybe the whole cutting thing was like a refence to that Dawn is really a teen aged girl, not a the mysterious energy=Teh Key

[Dlou444]

I thought the whole thing was just to prove she was "real".
It's been a long time since I was a teen, but I imagine that if someone told me I was a mystical "key" and all my memories were made up, I'd kinda wanna cut myself to see if I bled and if I did, to show everyone I was as real as they were.

I've never BEEN a cutter, but I thought the mentality around it was to FEEL. That the people who do it don't feel like they're real like everyone else and think the pain and the blood makes them more a "part" of everyone else.
This really makes no difference, except for that is what they SAY about people who are cutters. So, if the writers heard this, they well could have taken that and realized it fit for Dawn quite well, at the moment and kind of tossed it in.

I've always liked Buffy for just this reason. Kind of addressing the same things normal "teen" shows do but not shoving it down your throat. It's one of the reasons I really liked Willow's magic addiction. It was the same lesson and yet SO much more fun than another "main character on diet pills" or something like that.

[InLoveWithBuffy]

I've always liked Buffy for just this reason. Kind of addressing the same things normal "teen" shows do but not shoving it down your throat. It's one of the reasons I really liked Willow's magic addiction. It was the same lesson and yet SO much more fun than another "main character on diet pills" or something like that.


I always thought that Willow's magic addiction was referral to Teen Girls Getting Drunk or drug addiction....

Edit:

Metaphor, that was the word I was looking for! thanks Kemy for using that word

[Dlou444]

Hey those diet pills are UPPERS! Are diet pills not drugs?
If not, my parents really scared me off EVERYTHING didn't they?
BRAVO MOM AND DAD!

[Joyce Summers]

Yeah, I think Dawn did the cutting to prove she was real. Spike just told her the monks had sent 'mystical energy' in the form of a sister, essentially wiping out Dawn's entire existence by this revelation. Cutting herself told her she was there she existed. When Buffy and Joyce run over to Dawn she says to them 'Is this blood? I'm not a key, I can't be a key' because the blood proves she was human.

Lots of 'cutters' (I put that in inverted commas because I hate that term and the term 'self-harmers'; it's too categorized) claim that was the same reason they did it. To prove they were still here, real despite what they were going through. Within a Buffy context this reason was just an entire other level. It was both a literal message and a metaphorical one I think, which was nice. Well not nice as in nice-nice...oh you know what I mean.

[InLoveWithBuffy]

Yeah, I think Joss is so good making this kind of things in series

[crabby patty]

Self harm is not always about feeling it is also about control.

When everything is falling apart around you someone who does self harm may do it to have some control over themselves!

If that makes sense!

[InLoveWithBuffy]

It makes sense... Maybe....

[Blondie Bear]

Self harm is not always about feeling it is also about control.

When everything is falling apart around you someone who does self harm may do it to have some control over themselves!

If that makes sense!

I've heard that same reasoning for anorexia, bulimia . . . just about any self-destructive behavior. You can't control your life, but you can control what you put into your body--so you put nothing in there. Or you force it to leave. Or you control your physical pain by cutting. It makes sense, though it's not psychologically healthy.

[InLoveWithBuffy]

I've heard from my best friend that when she cuts herself, she tries to forget something and pay attention to the pain. What if Dawn tried to forget that she was The Key?

[Five]

KEVIN: So I heard you, like, had a freak-out and cut yourself.
DAWN: Uh, no, not even. It was a whole ... it was so not...
KEVIN: I've felt like that before. Things get so crazed, you know, you just feel like you wanna do something ... extreme.
DAWN: Yeah. I just ... I had a lot of intense stuff going on. A lot of people don't understand that. Pain.
(The Body)

I think little Kevin here kinda gets it right.

Dawn was hurting. That's the explanation.
When you hurt like that, you don't get it. Because the pain is so vivid and yet, no open wound, no broken bone. You cannot deal with the pain because it's unknown, it's new, it's like nothing you've seen or heard of before. It just questions your own life, your own being, which is just the exact same thing Dawn is dealing with. So, in order to make the pain into something you can deal with, you have to locate it, and therefore to place it somewhere. So you hurt yourself physically so you know where it hurts, and so you can see it, really feel it and have an explanation for it, understand it.

I also believe it's about control, as some of you said. Dawn's life was just totally unraveling, nothing she had lived was real, man, she wasn't even real ! That's the feeling teens can get. They're not as good, they're not as strong, so they're not as alive, not as "here" as the others are. And they cannot control it. So they try to control it, or at least to control something. It's a quest for answers, for control in your life, and for somehow purity.

That's it, I believe. It's about misplacing your anger, your focus, your hunger for control and understanding, just so you can have the brief feeling of satisfaction when you feel like you've got it. But in fact, well, you really haven't.

I totally agree with you, Blondie Bear. Food disorders are to be put in the same category... And it takes a lot of self-control and will to be able to put oneself out of this...

Okay that post was just so depressing, I'm sorry.

[hyperballadbrad]

Well there is the whole idea that she was so upset at the fact she wasn't an 'original' person and was created, so took a knife to her skin. As Spike has said, 'blood is life' so she was spilling some to show her own life

So her brain is telling her that she is a human being, a real person, and on the other hand she knows she was created. It must have been so difficult to contemplate!

And on the other hand, it's an adolescent thing to self harm, and expressed an avenue of 'teen angst'

[Fake Shemp]

i knew plenty of people who self harmed as a teenager and plus i gotta agree with the theme of blood (even had to be angels back in becoming part 2)

[fly on the wall]

It's not really a question of why self-injurers do it, but why Dawn did it. I self-injure (currently in recovery) but I can't say Dawn did it for the same reasons I do it. Each person that self-injures has a unique reason. I think Dawn's reasoning was, as many have said, to feel "real," to validate the pain. I think she needed proof that she was real, not a lie, not a ball of mystical energy, but a person with thoughts and feelings and blood. And perhaps, as Kevin said, she wanted to do something extreme so that her mom and sister would take notice of her pain. Sort of a "screw you for keeping this from me" in a sense.

[eunsoma]

Maybe its just Dawn wanting attention... lol jokes. I agree with what you guys said about her wanting to prove not only to herself, but to the others, that she was a human and had the same biological build up as everyone else, therefore making herself be seen as 'real'.

[insanezenmiss]

aw the cleptomaina was for attention. She stole to see if anyone would notice. I agree the cutting was about prooving to herself she was alive. It was like a way to put the confusion and pain and fear into one place. The hope is....that is real blood in me... the faith was...this blood is summer's blood. Anyway Dawn is not a cutter, dawn is not a depressed maladjusted person wit hno personal support system. So she isnt acting out. She was jsut under the weight of wanting to find out what she was and how she related to the world around her.

In the opening sences of S5 dawn writes in her diary about how she was something special and they would soon see her, give her a place in the buffy world. ( i am generalising and paraphrasing of course) But my point is, at first she was a teen ager with all the possibilities of being important, all the dreams of being discovered, validated and seen as a mature young woman. Those normal *normal* teen fantasies shattered before they where realised, when she is forced to question if even her existance if valid.
I dont blame the girl for a momentary crack up, in fact i would blame her if she DID NOT react.

[Dlou444]

Okay, call me weird, but I don't get it.

I mean, I understand what I'm reading..."stealing for attention" and all the theories behind "cutting". But, none of it really makes a whole heck of a lot of sense in my head.

I'm not asking for ANYONE who said they have done either to go into details or spill their guts, but I think that just saying it's simply for attention HAS to be missing something.

I was a teen once. And, YES, I wanted attention...from my friends, people who weren't my friends, my parents....and perhaps occasionally these things imploded into bad events. But, I don't remember setting OUT to gain bad attention.
Like the shoplifting. It would be one thing if we were seeing Dawn out with her friends and them seeing her as "cool" for the stealing. But, as it was, she was just stealing and hoarding. The only two outcomes were 1.) nothing ever happens or 2.) everyone finds out and she's hated and mistrusted.
Teenagers ARE prone to making some WHACKY decisions at times, but most are driven by something. They're not pathological. For Dawn to want to risk #2 happening, #1 would have to outweigh that consequence.
If she was dabbling in witchcraft, I'd get it. But she wasn't.

More importantly, again NOT asking for people's stories, isn't there usually a catalyst that sets people off into these things? Granted, sometimes peer pressure, but I give most kids credit for not just slicing into themselves because someone tells them to. Or at least not for very long.

I know I had a "wild time" when I was younger. It was set off when a friend of mine accidently killed himself. Luckily, it was gone by 16 and I was already well on my way to being the fuddy duddy I am today.

Dawn had a GREAT catalyst for the cutting. And sure plenty of trauma that could carry over into the stealing later. Still, the stealing has always been a bit questionable to me. Like there just wasn't enough "reason" for the action. She wanted attention, sure. But, the Halloween episode where she runs off with the vampires, THAT ONE makes sense. Just being a random closet clepto......that one is a bit iffier.

Sorry for the ranting novel. People are just so complex, it's always hard to understand the reasonings behind what people do and I find it amazingly interesting!

[fly on the wall]

Teenagers ARE prone to making some WHACKY decisions at times, but most are driven by something. They're not pathological. For Dawn to want to risk #2 happening, #1 would have to outweigh that consequence.
If she was dabbling in witchcraft, I'd get it. But she wasn't.

I don't like the term "for attention" in general, because I don't think it encompasses what anyone, Dawn in this case, is truly going for.

I think Dawn felt abandoned, Dawn felt ignored and neglected, Dawn felt shoved aside and underneath everyone's radar. And IMO stealing (which is very much an under-the-radar kind of thing) was a way to...vent(?) how she felt. I'm not sure I'm wording this correctly. But notice that she stole Buffy's birthday present, the leather jacket, right after nobody came to the mall with her. She felt ignored and alone, she did a lonely act maybe as a direct result of it. I also think part of her wanted to be caught (here's where the "for attention" bit comes in). She saved the things she stole with price tags still on them, she stole from the magic shop right under the Scoobies' noses, she gave Buffy her present with the security tag still on it...these things tell me she wasn't too careful about not being caught. You call her a "random closet klepto", but that wasn't exactly the case. It wasn't something she yelled to the heavens, but she wasn't especially careful, was she? I think she wanted someone to find out. I think any attention, even negative, would have been a welcome change at this point. A chance for them to worry and care...sort of how a toddler will test its limits with its parents by doing things it knows will result in punishment (but more advanced, of course). She wanted someone to notice and care and even yell at her.

More importantly, again NOT asking for people's stories, isn't there usually a catalyst that sets people off into these things?
Yes, absolutely. And Dawn had a major catalyst for the self-harm. The kleptomania was more of a habit that grew over time, as did Dawn's feelings of abandonment.

[Aussie]

I think Dawns cutting was different to most self harmers cutting - she wanted proof that she was a real person who bled and felt pain. Im sure that is the case for some cutters, for others it is all about control. You cant control some things in life but you can control how deep you cut. The blood is a release/relief, like a drug. Most self harmers never want anyone to find out.

[fly on the wall]

^ I get what you're saying, but "self-harm" isn't synonymous with "cutting." Just thought I'd point that out.
And it's hard to gauge why "most" self-injurers do it. Each person has their own unique reason. I do agree that Dawn's self-injury wasn't in the "norm"...because, let's be honest, not many people discover they're mystical energy and all of their memories are fake. :)

[VisionGuy]

Self mutilation is not cool. Whether it's cutting, eating glass, eye gouging, or sitting on a C4 Explosive. I don't care why you do it. There's no reason why people should harm themselves in any way.

[Blondie Bear]

Dawn was hurting. That's the explanation.
When you hurt like that, you don't get it. Because the pain is so vivid and yet, no open wound, no broken bone. You cannot deal with the pain because it's unknown, it's new, it's like nothing you've seen or heard of before. It just questions your own life, your own being, which is just the exact same thing Dawn is dealing with. So, in order to make the pain into something you can deal with, you have to locate it, and therefore to place it somewhere. So you hurt yourself physically so you know where it hurts, and so you can see it, really feel it and have an explanation for it, understand it.


That actually makes a lot of sense. In my Sensation/Perception class, I learned that when your feelings are hurt or in turmoil or something, it actually ACTIVATES THE PAIN CENTER IN YOUR BRAIN. This stuff LITERALLY hurts, not just figuratively. But there's no corresponding physical nerve damage; it's all in your head (but not in the you're-imagining-it way, if that makes sense). I know when that happens to me, the pain seems to manifest as a pressure in my chest, which I express as "my heart hurts" or something (though it's obviously not a physical problem with my heart). But there have been times where I hurt so bad I fully expected to have a heart attack or something, because anything that hurt THIS badly HAD to have physical consequences. So I guess I can understand the need to actualize the pain in a physically understandable way.

Incidentally, that contradicts that whole "Words will never hurt me" thing . . . because mean words cause the pain receptors in your brain to fire!

[DrusillaRox]

I always had the theory that dawn was cutting herself in the sense that she wanted to have pain she could understand

[Dlou444]

I don't like the term "for attention" in general, because I don't think it encompasses what anyone, Dawn in this case, is truly going for.

I think Dawn felt abandoned, Dawn felt ignored and neglected, Dawn felt shoved aside and underneath everyone's radar. And IMO stealing (which is very much an under-the-radar kind of thing) was a way to...vent(?) how she felt. I'm not sure I'm wording this correctly. But notice that she stole Buffy's birthday present, the leather jacket, right after nobody came to the mall with her. She felt ignored and alone, she did a lonely act maybe as a direct result of it. I also think part of her wanted to be caught (here's where the "for attention" bit comes in). She saved the things she stole with price tags still on them, she stole from the magic shop right under the Scoobies' noses, she gave Buffy her present with the security tag still on it...these things tell me she wasn't too careful about not being caught. You call her a "random closet klepto", but that wasn't exactly the case. It wasn't something she yelled to the heavens, but she wasn't especially careful, was she? I think she wanted someone to find out. I think any attention, even negative, would have been a welcome change at this point. A chance for them to worry and care...sort of how a toddler will test its limits with its parents by doing things it knows will result in punishment (but more advanced, of course). She wanted someone to notice and care and even yell at her.


Yes, absolutely. And Dawn had a major catalyst for the self-harm. The kleptomania was more of a habit that grew over time, as did Dawn's feelings of abandonment.

Okay, I THINK I get this theory. Lemme make sure.
So, the theory would be that she was stealing in a way to "take back"? They wouldn't give her attention so she stole from the magic box and then they didn't go to the mall with her so she stole the jacket. We know she stole other things, but we can probably safely assume she had the same reasons for that too.

And if she didn't get caught she was still kind of secretly "sticking it to them" and if she DID, they'd get it.
Am I close? I'm in a sleep stupor and just woke up after kind of passing out from exhaustion, so if I didn't get it, it's not your fault, it's mine!
Thanks! That makes more sense!

[fly on the wall]

^ Yeah, that's the reasoning I think Dawn had, at any rate. :)

[kater]

I can kinda see where Dawn is coming from. Like Spike said, blood=life. If a credible source said you weren't alive and it was a distinct possibilty, don't you think you might try to see if you still bleed? I know I would and I never ever cut in high school. I think it makes sense that she did that from a number of standpoints, I mean, it brings attention, good or bad, and it also proves to herself that she is indeed alive.

[horrorshock666]

personally i feel she did it out of a total lack of control over herself and her emotions. everything around her was questionable, her family, her memorys, her friends... i feel that she did it to gain a sense of control, a way of her saying that maybe she had no choice of where she came from but what she felt was still real. I also think it was as people have also said, a way of having control when desperation surrounded her. Also i think it might have been her cry for help... she needed them to know what she felt and although she did it in an extreme way i think it worked.
I think its great a show like Buffy can cover such a subject but not glamourise it in any way. It is poignant and relevant to the story, not just there for being theres sake.
x

[Lindsey McDonald]

personally i feel she did it out of a total lack of control over herself and her emotions. everything around her was questionable, her family, her memorys, her friends... i feel that she did it to gain a sense of control, a way of her saying that maybe she had no choice of where she came from but what she felt was still real. I also think it was as people have also said, a way of having control when desperation surrounded her. Also i think it might have been her cry for help... she needed them to know what she felt and although she did it in an extreme way i think it worked.
I think its great a show like Buffy can cover such a subject but not glamourise it in any way. It is poignant and relevant to the story, not just there for being theres sake.
x

Yeah. It isn't "The one where the teenage girl self harms". The narrative integrity came first, and the self-harm slotted in nicely second. It was dealt with really well.

[DrusillaRox]

its never just teenage girl self harms theres always a reason

[scobro]

How would Buffy react if she would be in Dawn's position?
Bone Spike till she felt better about herself? Same situation- neither thought they were real or they belonged.

Edit:

I mean, I understand what I'm reading..."stealing for attention" and all the theories behind "cutting". But, none of it really makes a whole heck of a lot of sense in my head.

I'm not asking for ANYONE who said they have done either to go into details or spill their guts, but I think that just saying it's simply for attention HAS to be missing something.

Well, when I cut myself (though no girl but I would assume it wouldnt much matter, right?) it wasnt for attention but a need to feel again.

When I was depressed I could take the razor out that I carried with me and cut myself. Once the blood started to flow (though never enough to fully bleed, you had to be careful and not get too excited or you would cut too deep and the drops of blood would be a flow.. first time that happened a co-worker though I had a nosebleed and just dripped on my shirt! haha) and the RUSH you got (or I got) from doing that kicked in, I knew I was alive, I knew I was a person and not a hollowed out shell.

Feeling it tear through the skin, watching the first glimpse of crimson peeking through the maw that was my forearm/chest (i varied it up) it really was a rush. It made me feel again, if only pain. And yes, to feel pain is better than nothing.

I cannot speak on everyone but I can say without a doubt I am not alone, and that not everyone who cuts theirselves is looking for attention. I was not.

(aren't I the lil ball o' sunshine!!)

[Aussie]

Cutting generally is known to be a coping mechanism. It is a BAD coping mechanism but that is what it is, put very simply.

[Lindsey McDonald]

its never just teenage girl self harms theres always a reason

Sorry, I didn't mean to imply that. I was referring to the teen television convention to have a "Drugs" episode, a "Teenage Pregnancy" episode, and a "Self-Harm" epsiode. I always respect TV shows that deal with such issues without structuring an episode around them.

[Kemy]

Dlou, back when I was...doing that I used to go to some extraordinary lengths to cover it up. The only reason anyone knew was the one time I forgot to hide it.

I didn't like, or want, the attention it brought and was kicking myself for lapsing that once. But it did bring it to the attention of my friends (at the time) and they helped me.

Once people knew it actually helped me stop. I heal fast but there are still marks, and it does catch the odd persons eye when I'm wearing something sleeveless, but I don't care what dirty looks they give me now.

[Dlou444]

That's what I thought! Not that it's ever a SMART plan, but a REALLY dumb plan to try to do for attention!