"Crush" Discussion

[LifeIsJustThis]

Hey all! Now we have an official Crush discussion post!

I just re-watched this, and I think it’s one of my favorite episodes.

...How the hell does Buffy get into all these taped-off crime zones without being noticed?
Also, how the HELL does Spike steal Xander’s change at the beginning in the Bronze? I see him spill the beer, and pick up the bottle, but I do not see him swipe the change.

And how can Buffy not see that Spike likes her? She’s so self-involved, she so doesn’t see the world around her ☺

Things I also love about this episode…
Joyce, Spike, and Dawn talking about the gallery shipment…
I love how Spike and Joyce like each other.
Buffy and Spike’s “date” in the car, stacking out the vamp nest warehouse…(hehe)
Spike singing The Sex Pistols…
Buffy: “You’re like a serial killer in prison!”
Drusilla: “And there you are, my darling deadly boy”
When Harmony shoots Spike with an arrow…
“Poor Spike. So lost. Even I can’t help you now.”
Drusilla knows what’s going on ☺

I think it’s funny how offended Buffy is by Spike’s profession of love. Usually, this kind of thing wouldn’t offend someone that much...any thoughts on Buffy's reaction?

And, how come Spike could get into the house before, and by the end of the ep he can’t? Did they do a invitation reversal spell?

How funny it is it how mean she is to him in Crush, and then in the following episode, I Was Made To Love You, she asked him to protect her family.

By the way, has anyone seen Passions? It’s a real show, with dolls and all, like Spike says. It’s a very, shall I say, non-traditional soap.

[Blondie Bear]

I think it’s funny how offended Buffy is by Spike’s profession of love. Usually, this kind of thing wouldn’t offend someone that much...any thoughts on Buffy's reaction?


Think of the person you hate most in the entire world. Someone who grosses you out just being alive.

Now imagine s/he professes undying love for you.

That's about what Buffy's feeling. And she's one of those people whose first thought in stuff like this is "what's WRONG with me?" especially since she was already wondering that because of Angel, Parker, and Riley. It grosses her out that Spike likes her, and bothers her deeply (I'm not sure "offended" is really the right word) that there's something about her that nasty, gross, evil Spike (her opinion, NOT mine) finds attractive.

[LifeIsJustThis]

Yes. LOL So true. She does find him attractive deep down...that THAT is what disturbs her.

[Five]

I totally agree with you, Blondie Bear. We fans have a tendency to not get Buffy on this, because we've learned to like Spike. When we watch the episode again, we've seen seasons 6 and 7, our love for the character has grown and even though the events that made us love him haven't all happened yet, we still love him. So it's hard to put ourselves in Buffy's point of view. It has to be remembered that, at this point, she hates him totally. And noone can blame her for that, he's been so mean in seasons 2-4. Season 5 really is the pivotal (?) season for his character. Personally, I don't really like Spike and I believe the end of the show was much too focussed on him, instead of on Willow or Xander or Guy-les. (I'm sorry, thinking of Season 5 Spuffy makes me think of Buffybot.) But I can truly see how people might be upset about Buffy's reaction... wrongly, I guess, since it's really natural of her, and realistic.

[Kana]

QUOTE=LifeIsJustThis;549459]Hey all! Now we have an official Crush discussion post!

I just re-watched this, and I think it’s one of my favorite episodes.

...How the hell does Buffy get into all these taped-off crime zones without being noticed? [/QUOTE]

Because the police in Sunnydale are deeply stupid.

Also, how the HELL does Spike steal Xander’s change at the beginning in the Bronze? I see him spill the beer, and pick up the bottle, but I do not see him swipe the change.

Vamp speed.


And how can Buffy not see that Spike likes her? She’s so self-involved, she so doesn’t see the world around her

Denial.

Things I also love about this episode…
Joyce, Spike, and Dawn talking about the gallery shipment…
I love how Spike and Joyce like each other.
Buffy and Spike’s “date” in the car, stacking out the vamp nest warehouse…(hehe)
Spike singing The Sex Pistols…
Buffy: “You’re like a serial killer in prison!”
Drusilla: “And there you are, my darling deadly boy”
When Harmony shoots Spike with an arrow…
“Poor Spike. So lost. Even I can’t help you now.”
Drusilla knows what’s going on.

I loved those bits too. For some reason I also like the scene with Dru and Spike in the Bronze. It oozed sexiness.

I think it’s funny how offended Buffy is by Spike’s profession of love. Usually, this kind of thing wouldn’t offend someone that much...any thoughts on Buffy's reaction?

Like the others have said, she still thinks of Spike as an evil soulless vampire, the type which she kills? If she starts having fluffy feelings for the creatures she kills, then... oh wait lol.

And, how come Spike could get into the house before, and by the end of the ep he can’t? Did they do a invitation reversal spell?

She invited him in Becoming part 2 when they made a brief alliance.

How funny it is it how mean she is to him in Crush, and then in the following episode, I Was Made To Love You, she asked him to protect her family.

Ohh, need to rewatch that, I'll get back to you.

By the way, has anyone seen Passions? It’s a real show, with dolls and all, like Spike says. It’s a very, shall I say, non-traditional soap.

As far as I know, but I've never seen it.

[Tranquillity]

And, how come Spike could get into the house before, and by the end of the ep he can’t? Did they do a invitation reversal spell?

When Joyce and Willow say that Buffy should go and sort things out with Spike and tell him that she's not interested, Willow askes Buffy if she wants her to go along for moral support. Buffy declines the offer but says "But there is something you can do for me " (or something along those lines). The thing Will 'can do' is the de-invite spell.

[Ulrikke]

I just finished re-watching this episode, and I gotta say; an excellent episode. It really made me feel for Spike (ok, especially in hindsight). And I couldn't help but wonder, at the moment when Spike offered to turn his back on evil (and what an extraordinary offer!); Had Buffy been a little less harsh in her rejection of Spike, what would have happened? Spike said and showed time and time again that he was willing to turn his back on his whole lifestyle for Buffy. Imagine if he'd have had a little support in that. So many things could be different...

Another few random moments I enjoyed that haven't been mentioned.
The Scoobies in the Bronze,
'So you think that Glory's really -'
(Buffy spotting:) 'Ben!'
Ah, if only she knew... :p

Oh, and I really love Dawn and Spike together (which is also another sign that Spike is changing; it seems he's actually enjoying Dawn's company). I mean Spike's whole storytelling thing is kind of creepy, and it's kind of twisted that Dawn would enjoy those, but all the same...

[fly on the wall]

Usually, this kind of thing wouldn’t offend someone that much...any thoughts on Buffy's reaction?
If someone I despised professed their love to me, yeah, I can say I'd react in much the same way Buffy did.

How funny it is it how mean she is to him in Crush, and then in the following episode, I Was Made To Love You, she asked him to protect her family.
Buffy didn't like Spike. But she still knew he was the strongest one next to her, the most capable when it came to protecting her family. She knew (at first) that he wouldn't do anything to Joyce or Dawn because she would kill him. Then she knew he wouldn't do anything to them because he loved her. And she'd still kill him. :)

And yeah, they did the de-invitation spell on Spike.

[LifeIsJustThis]

I just finished re-watching this episode, and I gotta say; an excellent episode. It really made me feel for Spike (ok, especially in hindsight). And I couldn't help but wonder, at the moment when Spike offered to turn his back on evil (and what an extraordinary offer!); Had Buffy been a little less harsh in her rejection of Spike, what would have happened? Spike said and showed time and time again that he was willing to turn his back on his whole lifestyle for Buffy. Imagine if he'd have had a little support in that. So many things could be different...

Another few random moments I enjoyed that haven't been mentioned.
The Scoobies in the Bronze,
'So you think that Glory's really -'
(Buffy spotting:) 'Ben!'
Ah, if only she knew... :p

Oh, and I really love Dawn and Spike together (which is also another sign that Spike is changing; it seems he's actually enjoying Dawn's company). I mean Spike's whole storytelling thing is kind of creepy, and it's kind of twisted that Dawn would enjoy those, but all the same...
I agree. I LOVE Spike and Dawnie...

[Airam]

This episode has got to be in my top 10 also. I can't fault Buffy for her reaction, Spike hadn't been redeemed himself to Buffy even a little yet. But I can let her rejections go and still enjoy the episode when I re-watch it becaue I am secure in the knowledge that she did end up loving him AND she ends up kissing him out of her own free will just a few episodes later anyway :p I really could go on and on about scenes and quotes that I love about this episode.... Harmony acting like buffy to get Spike in the mood, "Oh, I'm gonna stake you! I'm coming after you, you bad, evil vampire, (gestures with the stake) and I'm gonna slay you! I'm sneaking up, and I'm going to stake you so much with my slaying powers that I have because I'm the chosen-," then Spike grabs her, hee.

I love the scene where Dawn goes to Spike crypt, the start talking and she tells hum she feels safe with him and he freaks out all offended and demands that she "take that back!"

The exchange when Buffy catches Spike telling Dawn the scary story:
BUFFY: Yeah. Okay. Let's hear the story that Spike is telling my little sister.
SPIKE: (nervous) Right. Yeah. (Shot of the two girls watching, Dawn interested, Buffy with her arms folded) So, uh, I knew the girl was in the coal bin. So I rip it open, very violent, haul her out of there ... (looks at Buffy) and then I give her to a good family in a nice home, (Buffy rolls her eyes) where they're never ever mean to her, and didn't lock her in the coal bin.

Freaking LOVE when they're in the car and Spike takes a swig from his flask and offers it to Buffy,
BUFFY: Ew.
SPIKE: It's not blood, it's bourbon.
BUFFY: (slower) Eeeeew.
SPIKE: (grins ruefully) Suit yourself.

When Harmony comes in to find Dru:
HARMONY: Who is - oh, wait. I get it. Our little sex game was just the beginning. Now you've gone and picked up some cheap queen of the damned to dress up like your precious Drood-zilla.
SPIKE: Harm.
HARMONY: You'd better not be thinking what I think you're thinking. 'Cause my answer is the same as always. No threesomes unless it's boy, boy, girl. Or Charlize Theron.
SPIKE: Harm, you moron, this *is* Drusilla.

But the very best thing in the whole episode is when Spike finally lets all the mounting frustration go:
SPIKE: If you don't admit ... that there's something there ... some tiny feeling for me ... then I'll untie Dru, let her kill you instead.
DRUSILLA: (nodding quickly) Yes, please. I like that game much more.
SPIKE: Just ... give me something ... a crumb ... a barest smidgen ... tell me ... maybe, someday, there's a chance.
Buffy looks intensely at him. He moves right up close to her.
BUFFY: Spike....
He looks hopeful.
BUFFY: The only chance you had with me was when I was unconscious.
SPIKE: (puzzled) Oh, what... (makes a face of extreme frustration) Ohh!
He turns away, throws the stake away and gives a loud angry yell.
SPIKE: (shouting) Gaaah! What the bleeding hell is wrong with you bloody women? What the hell does it take? Why ... do you bitches torture me?
BUFFY: Which question do you want me to answer first?

:lmao:

*sigh* its just so good, I used to have that sound clip of him exploding as the error message on my computer.

okay, I think I've gone on enough... man now I feel like I need to go watch this.

[punkypower]

Oh, and I really love Dawn and Spike together (which is also another sign that Spike is changing; it seems he's actually enjoying Dawn's company). I mean Spike's whole storytelling thing is kind of creepy, and it's kind of twisted that Dawn would enjoy those, but all the same...

I loved the Spawn element. One of the things that twerped me off most about the attempted rape was what it did to their relationship/dynamic.

I also love the Spoyce scenes. I liked "Crush's," but my fave has to be "Lovers Walk."

[sosa lola]

I liked this episode, but I hated the way Spike treated Harmony, she can be so annoying, sure, but she was the only one who gave a damn about him. And he would never appreciate her even in AtS. Sigh. I'm not a Harmony fan, but I do feel for her.

I also hated how pathetic Spike was when he tied both Buffy and Dru up, and my God, why the hell would you kill Drusilla? Yep, she had cheated on you with a disgusting demon. I'm sure it's a great blow to your self-esteem but kill her? And for who? Buffy? The slayer? Not only that, but like Xander, Spike can't take rejection well apparently. The girl isn't interested Spike, you can't just force her to love you.

Even though these two bits made my blood boil with anger at Spike, I was so glad they were there in the episode. I like to be reminded that Spike is a soulless vampire, it makes me admire him more because it's so hard for him to do the right thing from time to time.

Stuff that I really liked in the episode:

Spike telling Dawn scary stories about his past. Dawn's growing crush on Spike. So cute. Also Xander whining that he's the cool guy Dawn has a crush on, not Spike. Hee! Spike stealing Xander's money, and you wonder why Xander hates Spike? :D Plus Spike and Dawn laughing at Joyce's story, cute. Oh, oh, and my favorite: Joyce being glad that Buffy is around because she needed someone strong to protect them forgetting that Giles stayed over to protect them. Poor G-man.

Stuff I've noticed:

1- Reading many Spuffy fics lately I noticed that many write Joyce being really supportive of Buffy/Spike, probably even trying to get Buffy to see that Spike is a good catch. But what I saw in this ep is the entire opposite. Joyce wasn't supportive of the idea at all. She was as scared as Buffy and Willow. She wanted the whole thing over. Remember Joyce was the one who asked Angel to break up with Buffy because he's a vampire and Buffy is a human, why would Joyce change her mind now?

2- Xander's reaction to Spike being in love with Buffy is really amusing. Hee! I don't think Xander cares if Spike loves Buffy or not as long as nothing happens between them.

3- Harmony actually defending Spike from Drusilla in her Harm way, it's heartbreaking, especially that everybody takes her as a joke. But I guess she made that image stick in people's minds. It's like Anya with the Scoobies, they believe she's tactless and annoying because she acts like it most of the time. Same with the Scoobies believing that Xander is dumb. Believing that Giles is stuffy. Believing that Buffy can always fix it. Believing that Spike is evil. As they say: first impressions always stick.

[Airam]

1- Reading many Spuffy fics lately I noticed that many write Joyce being really supportive of Buffy/Spike, probably even trying to get Buffy to see that Spike is a good catch. But what I saw in this ep is the entire opposite. Joyce wasn't supportive of the idea at all. She was as scared as Buffy and Willow. She wanted the whole thing over. Remember Joyce was the one who asked Angel to break up with Buffy because he's a vampire and Buffy is a human, why would Joyce change her mind now?


I read alot of Spuffy fics too and that is so true, most that include Joyce do always portray her that way, as the Spike supporter, she might show reluctance at first but quickly comes around and usually gives Buffy a little push into Spike's direction. It is interesting because its true that Joyce was quite freaked out and troubled by the idea in "Crush" and it could be argued that Joyce's speech to Angel is a major reason he skipped town. I'd like to think though that had Joyce not died she eventually might have been that uber Spike supporter they portray in fics. She already had a bit of a soft spot for him, I mean she personally wasn't really threatned by Spike. I think she was just worried about the "vampire with no soul being obsessed with my daughter again" thing like she'd seen happen with Angelus. But had she not died and had been witness to all of Spike's growth especially during the Dawn/Glory stuff, I think she would have come around on the side of Spike.