Any freakish Spuffy/Bangel hybrids out there?

J. Ruby

J. Ruby

paralyzed with not caring
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I did a cursory search of the boards to see if this topic has already been discussed and I couldn't easily find such a thread, so please let me know if I missed it somewhere.

I was just wondering if there is anyone else out there like myself who enjoys both the Bangel and Spuffy relationships. I'm thinking there has to be!

Personally, my Buffy fandom began when I saw a commercial for OMWF (original airdate), thought it looked interesting enough, and decided to do a little catch-up by watching re-runs on FX in order to prepare myself. So I started with episodes like the "Becoming" two-parter, and then moved on to fresh episodes beginning with OMWF. I pretty much dropped in on the heart of both relationships.

At first I was primarily a Spuffy fan, but also found the Bangel 'ship to be quite touching. Spuffy is just so raw and sexually charged, whereas Bangel is pure and true and forever. Over time I began to realize that who Buffy "grows up" to be is largely due to her relationship with Angel, and that simply can't be overlooked, IMO.

Hybrids such as myself might enjoy Angel's return in "End of Days," when Buffy and Angel share a passionate "hello" kiss. The kiss carries over to the next, and final, episode "Chosen," in which Buffy sends Angel away. Angel is looking for her real reason for sending him away, and the following conversation ensues:

ANGEL
Is it Spike? You're not telling me something
and his scent"¦ I remember it pretty well.
BUFFY
You vampires. Didn't anybody ever tell you the whole
"smelling people" thing's a little gross?
ANGEL
Is he your boyfriend?
BUFFY
Is that your business?
ANGEL
Are you in love with him? ... Okay, maybe I'm out of
line but this is kind of a curve ball for me. I mean, we are
talking about Spike here.
BUFFY
It's different. He's different. He has a soul now.
ANGEL
Oh. Well.
BUFFY
What?
ANGEL
That's great. Everyone's got a soul now.
BUFFY
He'll make a difference.
ANGEL
You know, I started it. The whole having a soul. Before it
was all the cool new thing.
BUFFY
Oh, my god, are you twelve?
ANGEL
I'm getting the brush-off for Captain Peroxide. It doesn't
necessarily bring out the champion in me.
BUFFY
You're not getting the brush-off. Are you just going to
come here and go all Dawson on me every time I have a
boyfriend?
ANGEL
Aha! Boyfriend.
BUFFY
He's not. But"¦ he is in my heart.
ANGEL
That'll end well.
BUFFY
What was the highlight of our relationship"” when you
broke up with me or when I killed you? I'm well aware of
my stellar history with guys and no, I don't see fat
grandchildren in the offing with Spike. But I don't think
that really matters right now. You know, in the midst of all
this insanity, a couple of things are actually starting to
make sense. And the guy thing"¦ (sigh) I always feared
there was something wrong with me. You know, because I
couldn't make it work. But maybe I'm not supposed to.
ANGEL
Because you're the Slayer.
BUFFY
Because"¦ okay. I'm cookie dough. I'm not done baking.
I'm not finished becoming whoever the hell it is I'm going
to turn out to be. I make it through this and the next thing
and the next thing and maybe one day I turn around and
realize I'm ready. I'm cookies. And then, you know, if I
want someone to eat m"” or enjoy warm, delicious
cookie-me, then that's fine. That'll be then. When I'm done.
ANGEL
Any thoughts on who might enjoy"¦ do I have to go with
the cookie analogy?
BUFFY
I'm not really thinking that far ahead. That's kinda the
point.
ANGEL
I'll go start working on the second front. Make sure I don't
have to use it.
(Angel walks away, but Buffy calls to him.)
BUFFY
Angel.
BUFFY
I do"¦ sometimes think that far ahead.
ANGEL
Sometimes is something.
BUFFY
It'll be a long time coming. Years, if ever.
ANGEL
I ain't getting any older"¦
Click to expand...

And ultimately, even though Buffy (presumably) knows she'll always love Angel, she goes home to Spike and takes comfort in his arms.

Gotta love all the "jealous vampire crap," as Buffy puts it. Not to mention the suggestion of letting the two of them "wrastle it out," possibly involving oil. Buffy is a Spuffy/Bangel hybrid just like me!

To recap: Both Bangel and Spuffy give me warm fuzzies. Anyone else out there feel the same?
 
K
Kali
yeah - bit more than the warm and fuzzies though, Bangelus would have been the best!
Spuffy and Bangel are as good as each other as far as being functional relationships, because neither are, but I found Spuffy more interesting. With Spike and Buffy, on the one hand you've got someone mistaking a pathological obsession with love and on the other you've got someone who feels so isolated that they've really got no choice but to connect with the person obsessed with them. Bangel, on the other hand, was a first-love deal where their time together still has resonance later but is ultimately the result of both parties overplaying their respective emotions and eventually drifting apart when they start to mature. Both are based around a delusion of true love, but Spuffy had more sex, so I preferred it.
 
Joan the Vampire Slayer
Joan the Vampire Slayer
you are bloody brilliant, my friend. :)
J. Ruby
J. Ruby
Here here. :)
I
itsxpaperdoll
Love your banner ^^ and oh, good post :)
J. Ruby said:
I did a cursory search of the boards to see if this topic has already been discussed and I couldn't easily find such a thread, so please let me know if I missed it somewhere.

I was just wondering if there is anyone else out there like myself who enjoys both the Bangel and Spuffy relationships. I'm thinking there has to be!

Personally, my Buffy fandom began when I saw a commercial for OMWF (original airdate), thought it looked interesting enough, and decided to do a little catch-up by watching re-runs on FX in order to prepare myself. So I started with episodes like the "Becoming" two-parter, and then moved on to fresh episodes beginning with OMWF. I pretty much dropped in on the heart of both relationships.

At first I was primarily a Spuffy fan, but also found the Bangel 'ship to be quite touching. Spuffy is just so raw and sexually charged, whereas Bangel is pure and true and forever. Over time I began to realize that who Buffy "grows up" to be is largely due to her relationship with Angel, and that simply can't be overlooked, IMO.

Hybrids such as myself might enjoy Angel's return in "End of Days," when Buffy and Angel share a passionate "hello" kiss. The kiss carries over to the next, and final, episode "Chosen," in which Buffy sends Angel away. Angel is looking for her real reason for sending him away, and the following conversation ensues:



And ultimately, even though Buffy (presumably) knows she'll always love Angel, she goes home to Spike and takes comfort in his arms.

Gotta love all the "jealous vampire crap," as Buffy puts it. Not to mention the suggestion of letting the two of them "wrastle it out," possibly involving oil. Buffy is a Spuffy/Bangel hybrid just like me!

To recap: Both Bangel and Spuffy give me warm fuzzies. Anyone else out there feel the same?
Click to expand...

Great post!

It always seems like it's one of the other, you know? You're either a Spuffy for a Bangel (Ruffy never seems to make the cut). It's always about which relationship was "better", etc. But I don't think it's about that. Everyone has their personal preference, sure, but I also point out that both relationships were intergal to Buffys development and shaping of who she is today.

I am a self-professed Spuffy. I, like JCC, just found it more interesting. And I think JM is one of the hottest men ever....

But..I love Angel as well. She is a great, complex character. I didn't really realize how much I liked him until he left to do Angel and became his own person seperate from Buff. He was really one-demensional. He was basically just Buffy's-love-interest guy. Actually, I liked him better on BtVS as the Buig Bad Angelus - he was given even more depth, I felt. And man, was he scary!

Anyway, both Bangel and Spuffy have their moments. I always cry in "The Prom" when Angel breaks up with her. I cringe in "Innocence" when he says, "You were great. Really. I thought you were a pro." *shudders

I cry at the end of "Chosen" when she tells him she loves him. I cry in the church scene in "Beneath You".

It's just that, from the beginning, I always knew Bangel would never work out. It could just never be. It was the ultimate forbidden, unattainable love. What she wanted from him she could never have.

I always knew Buff and Spike had a chance. They are kindred spirts, they can relate, he's real with her, she can be real with him. There was always sexual tension there, so when they finally got together I was totally stoked.

As a result of this love he had for her, he became a better man. You can say that about Angel too. Buffy just does that to guys 🙂 I mean, if Angel had never been shown Buffy by Whistler he could have never been inspired to get his life together and help her, and as a result, save the helpless.

Story short: I like both relationships for their respective purposes, but I like Spuffy better 🙂

It just irritates me when people say Angel is Buffy's "soulmate". I just don't think that is true. Yet, I don't think Spike is either. .. she's cookie dough, she'll find him someday 🙂
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JCC said:
Spuffy and Bangel are as good as each other as far as being functional relationships, because neither are, but I found Spuffy more interesting. With Spike and Buffy, on the one hand you've got someone mistaking a pathological obsession with love and on the other you've got someone who feels so isolated that they've really got no choice but to connect with the person obsessed with them. Bangel, on the other hand, was a first-love deal where their time together still has resonance later but is ultimately the result of both parties overplaying their respective emotions and eventually drifting apart when they start to mature. Both are based around a delusion of true love, but Spuffy had more sex, so I preferred it.
Click to expand...

This is a incredibly insightful post and I totally agree with everything you said. 🙂
 
J. Ruby
J. Ruby
Beautiful, thank you. BTW, I had to go watch "End of Days" and "Chosen" after posting this. Hehe!
U
Ulrikke
I was going to post, but your post made what I was going to say redundant. You took the words right out of my mouth!
I prefer Spuffy, though I don't hate Bangel. I was never really a fan of Angel's character when he was on BtVS, though I did like him on AtS.

I think Spike/Buffy is the more interesting relationship, and it's the one I'm more "familiar" with as if I rewatch, I tend to rewatch from season four and up.

I also read a lot of fic, and nearly all of it is Spuffy... I don't think I could bring myself to read a Bangel fic. In canon, I'm fine with it but in fanon - nuh-uh.
 
JCC said:
Spuffy and Bangel are as good as each other as far as being functional relationships, because neither are, but I found Spuffy more interesting. With Spike and Buffy, on the one hand you've got someone mistaking a pathological obsession with love and on the other you've got someone who feels so isolated that they've really got no choice but to connect with the person obsessed with them. Bangel, on the other hand, was a first-love deal where their time together still has resonance later but is ultimately the result of both parties overplaying their respective emotions and eventually drifting apart when they start to mature. Both are based around a delusion of true love, but Spuffy had more sex, so I preferred it.
Click to expand...

This is seriously the most insightful post I've read today. I agree witih everything you said. 🙂
 
Okay I must be the ultimate freak in the Buffy relationships then. I love Bangel, I love Ruffy and I love Spuffy. I don't hate any of the relationship.

The great romantic part of me (a huge part, haha) adores Buffy and Angel. Their love for one another is what every girl dreams love to be like, but the tragedy of their situation is something awful yet romantic that appeals to that same girl. The tragedy we worship yet would hate to be put through ourselves. Bangel allows me to indulge in all romantic cliches.

Riley makes me like the Buffy and Riley coupling. He is so sweet and gawky at the very beginning that I am immediately endeared to him and I'm soon rooting for the two crazy kids to make it work, haha. And the way he continues to love her no matter how much she shuts him out or how much he knows she doesn't love him back as much, endears me even more. He's such a pure good guy that I don't doubt would jump off of a cliff if he knew it would save her from god knows what, and I know that's, metaphorically, what he wanted to do for her when her Mom was sick. Make the pain go away. He's a sweetie and if a load of, well, crap hadn't been going on all at once in her life I think the two would have worked out.

And Spuffy....there's passion there. No doubt about that. But Spike's adoration stops it from being just raw heat and adds sentimentalism to it, which makes it...realer I suppose and more able to appeal to the audience. I always had a soft spot for Spike though and when, in season 5, he starts being good for Buffy's sake, that was enough for me to see the potential. But then you know, Buffy had been down that road and it led to craposity so I never really cared too much for it until Dead Things when he just let's her beat the hell out of him because he knows she needs too. That's when I was all 'oh my gosh' and I loved it as much as I loved the two previous relationships, but not for the relationship itself, not for Buffy but for how Spike was in the relationship. He was the one that made it work for me I think.
 
J. Ruby
J. Ruby
Very good, thank you! I don't hate Ruffy entirely either. :)
Joan the Vampire Slayer
Joan the Vampire Slayer
Who doesn't love Ruffy?
I think that Angel made a great first love for Buffy. I have never doubted the depth and sincerity of their feelings for each other, and I have no doubts whatsoever that Buffy will love Angel for as long as she lives. I also believe absolutely that, while Angel might be the great romance of her life, Spike will always be the greatest passion that Buffy will ever encounter. Angel and Spike both fill critical parts of Buffy's life, and she loves, and will always love, them both. She would not be the person who she finally became without either of them.

I also believe that, in the end, Buffy will make her lifelong commitment to neither one. Her "long term guy" hasn't shown up on the scene yet, and may not for quite some time to come. (Now, if I had MY druthers, one day there would be a visitor come knocking on the door of Slayer Central in the Scottish highlands, and when Buffy opened the door, true love would at last be there: "Hello, I'm Duncan Macleod of the Clan Macleod...")
 
I
InsaneMystic
funky crossover! I'd love to see that happen! :D
Watching seasons 1-2, Bangel is all that it is, for me. And there's no Spuffy yet, not really, so what choice do I have. Buffy and Angel had a very tragic story, which really worked for me. But season 3 ruined them. I felt disgust with them. And this is before Spuffy came to life. Then Spuffy came along, and I have a new love to love, it was more interesting, more challenging, more beautiful. To me, it beat Bangel. But generally speaking, I'm Bangel in the first 2 seasons, and a Spuffy in the rest. But I still call myself a complete Spuffy. Season 1-2 were nice, but bye bye now. Bangel is the past (and my past) and Spuffy is the future (and my future, I believe).
 
I
InsaneMystic
100 % agreement, I absolutely feel the same way about Bangel blehness after Becoming!
i dont hate any of the relationships either. i have my leanings, and you all know im a big ruffy fan which makes me a freak in itself, but i dont dislike any of the other relationships. spuffy was hard for me to accept the first time i saw it, but now i think its cute... if anything i just get mad at buffy all the time for the way she treats spike. and bangel is well, timeless. i dunno. i like em all too.
 
J. Ruby
J. Ruby
Freak!!! LOL. ;)
Personally I am very neutral about all so called ships on the show.
Don't hate any of them and are not fanatic about any. It's just not the reason why I love BtVS.

Wait, if there is such a thing like a scooby gang ship. Then I would call myself a huge supporter of that.

/SK
 
J. Ruby
J. Ruby
Mental picture.... :O
I love them both. Bangel for the romance, the devotion, the innocence, in a way. Spuffy for the hotness, the complexity and pushing the barriers of everything - relationship, sex, comfort. I too would like to see a naked fight to the near death over Buffy, or even a Sbangeluffy menage a trois , but that so won't happen in this dimension. Still maintain Bangelus would have been the relationship with the greatest wow factor we would have seen. As long as he could have resisted killing her.
 
J. Ruby
J. Ruby
Hot fuzzies. ;)
I like both Spuffy and Bangel. Both work in the show.

Ultimately though, I don't want Buffy to end up either EITHER.
 
Okay, first, I'm not really involved too much in the Bangel/Spuffy war, BUT, as you know, I'm really into Cangel, so for me it's more of a Bangel/Cangel question.
This might come surprising to some people, but I think you can really enjoy two ships equally, even though they're impossible to really exist next to each other.
I don't hate Bangel (gasp!). Of course I enjoy Cangel more and think it's the 'real deal', but it doesn't mean I have an innate Bangel-hate-gene or anything. Approximately a year ago I even did a Bangel video for youtube 😉 And I do realize that Cangel wouldn't have been the same without Angel first having that relationship with Buffy. And that relationship wasn't total crap either, of course, I hated the whining and stuff, but it had its nice moments. I personally like to describe Bangel as "It's been fun while it lasted, now it's over". So with that in mind, imo it is not weird to not hate all ships that stand in the way of one's favourite ship. So, accordingly, I think there are probably some ship1/ship2 hybrids out there 😉
With Spuffy/Bangel, the first thing that comes to my mind is that this is really a win-win situations for those hybrids...I mean, if Buffy ever choses one of her two vampires, the hybrid does not really have to worry about who she picks. Somehow I really think thats's awesome.
I myself am more on the Spuffy side, probably because I can just identify way better with that relationship (and Cangel for that matter!) thn I ever could with Bangel. Bangel is just this sort of relationship (how it started, with those tragic heroes, this whole 'Romeo & Juliet' likeness) I never had with anyone, so I don't really get it that much.
So, I'm probably not too much of a hybrid, but I do admire you hybrid types to some level.
 
I love both ships. They worked into the stages of the show and the positions Buffy was in. Still, I usually say I'm a Spuffy, mainly because I think Spike is a much better character than Angel.
 
I think it is well documented where my loyalties lie😉 However I don't 'hate' Spuffy, not the relationship itself. What I do hate is when rabid Spuffy fans make it into something it was not. At its best Spuffy was a beautiful friendship and I think when Spike died he was Buffy's best friend. I think she loved him and needed him. What I find annoying is when people try to proclaim that Spuffy was true love...never, not once was is portrayed that way on the show and it is this rewriting of the story is what ultimately turns me off the their relationship altogther.
 
F
Five
Thanks for saying in great English what I've been trying to say but didn't know how.
A
Alien
I agree it was too violent and hostile to be love. Plus Spike tried to rape Buffy EEERRR!! Soul or no soul.
Keanoite said:
What I do hate is when rabid Spuffy fans make it into something it was not. At its best Spuffy was a beautiful friendship and I think when Spike died he was Buffy's best friend. I think she loved him and needed him. What I find annoying is when people try to proclaim that Spuffy was true love...never, not once was is portrayed that way on the show and it is this rewriting of the story is what ultimately turns me off the their relationship altogther.
Click to expand...

But isn't that the point of watching Buffy, or any show? Everyone interprets things their own way. I saw more love and passion in Spuffy than I ever did in Bangel; obviously not everyone thinks the same. I do not agree with the idea that Spuffy was never shown as true love, because that's all perception. There was, in my view, more than enough evidence that Buffy and Spike really and truly loved each other.
 
In the first two seasons I loved Bangel. They were so cute together! But then in S3 they started annoying me.
And then when Spike fell in love with her... I already loved Spike in the first scene with him and Dru and when he appeared again in S4 he became my favorite character and when they first kissed I became a Spuffy-fan.

I do really like Bangel but I still think Angel belongs with Cordy and not with Buffy. Of course now she's dead but I'm still rooting for Spuffy. Plus I think Angel is cooler without Buffy. I loved him in his own show so much more than in Buffy!

"Aha! Boyfriend!"
I love that part! So funny. He really seems like 12 sometimes... Well Spike's not really better, is he? With his sketch of Angel on his punching bag.
 
Kelsey said:
But isn't that the point of watching Buffy, or any show? Everyone interprets things their own way. I saw more love and passion in Spuffy than I ever did in Bangel; obviously not everyone thinks the same. I do not agree with the idea that Spuffy was never shown as true love, because that's all perception. There was, in my view, more than enough evidence that Buffy and Spike really and truly loved each other.
Click to expand...

I disagree strongly with that but your right everyone interprets it differently. It's the same with Fred/Wesley and Gunn. I loved Fred with Gunn, they seemed the epitome of a loving relationship but most seemt to prefer her with Wesley.

I think that has a lot to do with the characters rather than the couple. People love Spike, people love Wesley...both men were in love with women who didn't love them and so that added tragedy and romance to the relationships that maybe wouldn't have been there if the characters weren't so popular. It made them more attractive to the viewer.
 
Keanoite said:
I disagree strongly with that but your right everyone interprets it differently. It's the same with Fred/Wesley and Gunn. I loved Fred with Gunn, they seemed the epitome of a loving relationship but most seemt to prefer her with Wesley.

I think that has a lot to do with the characters rather than the couple. People love Spike, people love Wesley...both men were in love with women who didn't love them and so that added tragedy and romance to the relationships that maybe wouldn't have been there if the characters weren't so popular. It made them more attractive to the viewer.
Click to expand...
All interpretations are valid. We all see things differently, and we all asign meaning to things in our own way. This is why BtVs is so amazing...we all see something different in it.
And I agree about Fred and Gunn. I prefer them to Fresley.
 
I'm both, too.

I probably lean more toward Bangel, though, since I do feel in my gut that Buffy will never love any other guy as much as she loved Angel. Theirs is the kind of love that after not being together for two years, he can show up at her mother's graveside, slip his hand into hers, and she just knows who it is.

But then again, I cheered when Buffy told Spike she loved him, and I find a lot of things about Spuffy to admire. The maturity of their S7 relationship, the "love conquers all" aspect of Spike's personality.

So yeah, I don't necessarily claim to be a Bangel or a Spuffy...because I feel like once you say you're one, it means you're against the other, and that's just not the case for me.
 
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