Go Ahead and Argue But Buffy is The Slayer, and I Can prove it.

nerd4hire

nerd4hire

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One thing that's always bugged me is when people say Buffy is not The Slayer.

The arguement goes Buffy dies. Kendra is called. Kendra is now The Slayer. Kendra dies. Faith is called. Faith is now The Slayer.

I could never accept that arguement, because everyone on the show from Giles, to Beljoxa's Eye, to Faith, to Buffy herself refers to Buffy as The Slayer.

The problem was I could never figure out why that was. The closest I could come was "Buffy is The Slayer, because she guards the Hellmouth".

Then I was responding to a post from Parker Summers, and all of a sudden-- Epiphany!!!

I now know why Buffy is The Slayer.

The solution begins when the Scoobs are grilling the Bringer for information in the Summer's basement-- Touched.

ANDREW/BRINGER
We attend to the needs of infinite
Evil. We exterminate girls and
destroy the legacy of Slayer.
Click to expand...

I don't want any doubts, so let's define legacy:

legacy n., pl. cies. anything handed down from the past, as from an ancestor or predecessor.
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In other words, at that point in the Saga, when the current Potentials die, the slayer line dies.

The question becomes, how long have things been like that.

The First makes it's debut in Season 3, in Amends. It's agenda is the same in Amends as it is in S7. Keep Buffy and the vampire with a soul alive if he can. Sway the vampire over to the dark side.

At that time Kendra was dead. Faith and Buffy were alive. The First had no interest in Faith at that time, nor during S7. Why? Faith was not The slayer.

How could that be, you ask.

Let's go back to the first death of Buffy. She dies for a brief instant in time, then is brought back. Kendra is gifted with Slayer power. There are now 2 slayers.

The First isn't interested yet, though. The corruption that caused the end of the slayer line has not yet happened.

It happens when Kendra dies and Faith is called.

What the difference between the 2 events?

When Kendra was called there was no other living slayer. When Faith was called, there was another slayer in existence at the same time. This causes a kind of short circuit, which ends the slayer line. Enter the First. It can now capitalize on the corruption in the slayer line.

In the meantime, Buffy remains the last true slayer the line could run through -- The slayer.

A couple of possible arguements.

1. What about Fray? Something obviously happens after Season 7, that resparks the line.

2. In Showtime Anya interprets Beljoxa's eye as saying the corruption began as a result of Buffy's death in The Gift.

Beljoxa's eye never said that. It was only Anya's interpretation. This is understandable. Anya was not around the first time Buffy died.

3. Oh yeah, and before some silly says it, I'm not saying Buffy could pass on the slayer line in The Gift. I'm saying she was the last true slayer in that she had the capability to pass on the slayer line at one point.
 
All right, I believe you. Aren't epiphanies great?

A very convincing explanation, nerd4hire. My understanding is: Faith was the active Slayer before the events of "Chosen," but Buffy is the TRUE Slayer.
 
You should write a book. I always thought Faith should be considered the slayer, but you've got me convinced. I can't possibly argue with that. At first I was thinking 'but she couldn't pass on the line!" then you went and explained that. I agree with slayerangel on, Buffy is the slayer, faith is,or more correctly before Chosen, was, the active slayer. Very big difference. Consider the book lmao. Epiphanies are great.
 
Well that's my point see.

Every time I've ever had this debate with anyone (and trust me I've had it) they've always just chanted the slayer line to me like some sort of litany. You know:

and Buffy begat Kendra, and Kendra begat Faith, and...

I can never get past that. Well now I can say to them hang on there. There is no begatting after Kendra's begatting of Faith. Buffy is the last slayer who's ever had the capability to begat as far as we know. Therefore by your own definition Buffy is the one, true slayer.
 
I got it now. Thanks, nerd4hire! It's like proving who THE Slayer really is in the Buffyverse is like proving God exists in this world, lol.

One little contradiction, though. Marti Noxon has stated that if Faith died, another Slayer will be Called when questioned about Buffy's death. I'll post the article when I find it.

EDIT: I found the article. That was quick.

Tuesday, October 30, 2001

New Vampire Slayer Wanted?
by Charlie Mason



Where's the Watchers Council when you need it? Historically, every time that one Slayer is killed on Buffy the Vampire Slayer, another is magically drafted for active duty. Heck, back in the first season, Buffy (Sarah Michelle Gellar) only stopped breathing for a matter of seconds before a successor, Kendra (Bianca Lawson), was dispatched to Sunnydale. So, after Buffy spent the entire summer pushing up daisies, how come no new Slayer has been called to arms? Has the show forgotten its own mythology?

"We actually have an answer for that," executive producer Marti Noxon tells TV Guide Online. "It's a technicality. The reason [Buffy's demise didn't activate another vampire hunter] is that when she died the first time, a Slayer was called, so she's already had her replacement Slayer.

"It doesn't happen twice," she continues. "You only get one, and Buffy already did."

The fact that Kendra quickly kicked the bucket, and her next-in-line, Faith (Eliza Dushku), is behind bars makes no difference to the powers that be. "Since Faith is still alive," Noxon notes, "the line remains intact."

So, in other words, viewers shouldn't look for another stake-toting teenager to turn up in Sunnydale anytime soon "” at least not unless Dushku's burgeoning film career takes a dive. "It would take Faith dying for another Slayer to be called," Noxon says, "and since we can't get [Dushku] on the show, the odds of that happening aren't big."
Click to expand...

Source
 
Yeah...the sad thing here...I see where Marti is coming from...but even though she's a writer/producer...I think that Nerd4hire has that theory disproved...well...they screwed up...lol...good show N4H...I LOVED reading that! 😀
 
Yeah, the Marti Noxon quote.

As I said, I've had this conversation before. I'm familiar with the Marti Noxon quote.

David Solomon said Willow was going to be a substitue teacher in Season 7. She wasn't. A couple others from the production staff of Buffy said Season 7 was going to be a lighter, back to the beginning kind of thing, to get away from the darkness of Season 6. It wasn't.

Were they lying to throw us off the scent? Did they start off in one direction, and wind up in another.? Was it a case of only one person (Joss) really knowing what's going on? I don't know.

I know one thing though. You can't believe everything everyone at Mutant Enemy says.

Until a better explanation comes along, you're stuck with it. You have to believe what you see on the screen.

The Bringer said they were going to "destroy the Legacy" of the slayer. If Faith were to die, and another Potential was called, the slayer line would continue. You can't have both concepts. They contradict each other. You have to believe the one you see with you're own two eyes.

The First wanted to end the slayer line. It tried to kill Faith and the potentials to do it. That means killing Faith wasn't going to call another slayer.

I can trust my ability to reason, or I can have blind faith in a person representing a group of known prevaricators.

Actually the Marti Noxon quote isn't the correct arguement to this. I'll save some time, and show you where it is.

Perhaps the corruption in the slayer line has nothing to do with the slayer passing on to the existing group of potentials. Perhaps the corruption only stops the creation of new potentials.

If that were the case though, why would the First need Buffy alive, yet try to kill Faith.

It wanted to end the slayer line. Keeping Buffy alive while it killed the existing line had to have something to do with accomplishing this.

Why Buffy? Why not Faith, or Dawn, or the lady at the doublemeat palace in the chicken hat.

The only possible explanation I can come up with is Buffy is the Slayer. If the line passes, it passes through her.
 
I never had a doubt she was THE Salyer..But I really liked your explanation..You definitely should write a book..
 
Very nice explanation, but just because it's the only possible theory you can come up with, does not mean it's true. To prove something you must give us evidence, that only this theory is right, or that any other theory is impossible. Sorry, try harder.

The theory of Faith being THE slayer untill recently, is not proven false by you. You do point out, that if that theory is true, you can't explain what the First's plan was. But that in fact does not mean it is not true.

BTW: IMO, there's no THE slayer. There's slayers and that's it.
 
Hi Ally.

What kept you. I've been expecting you.

Let's get to it then shall we.

Originally posted by Allycat
just because it's the only possible theory you can come up with, does not mean it's true.
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You're absolutely correct of course, and I guess I have to come clean.

The title of this thread is nothing more than a bold lie to attract attention.

My defense to this strategy would be, "What the heck. Everyone else does it."

Let's be honest for a sec. The only person who knows the actual truth to the issues raised thus far is probably Joss, and his view of the slayer appears to be mutable from season to season. He even admitted this, when he said there were contradictions in the slayer myth when comparing Buffy to Fray. He promised to fix this in future writings; meaning the rules of the slayer myth are mutable.

Nevertheless things have to make sense in Buffy according to the rules that define themselves within the series as it progresses.

If you don't have this, nothing makes sense. If nothing makes sense you can't take the series seriously (unless of course the rule is , nothing makes sense, such as in Monyty Python or a Marx Bros movie, but that's not the case here).

Joss has suggested he wants his series to be available on a level where you can take them seriously. I used to have the quote where he said that, but I lost it. Can you just trust me? He said it.

All I'm saying is things need to make sense.

When I say stuff like:

The only possible explanation I can come up with .
Click to expand...

what I'm really saying is if you have an explanation that makes more sense, show it to me.
 
Well in order to make up some kind of explanation I would like you to answer the vital question in this debate. If you say 'Buffy is THE slayer', there's but one thing I should ask you.

What is THE slayer?

I know what 'a slayer' is, girl, with demon power, destined to kill demons, vampires, blah blah of the night and some more spooky sounding rhymes. That's A slayer. But what is THE slayer? I don't really understand the concept of this, I have my guesses to what you mean, but I don't think that in the verse this term was ever used.
 
Not that I'm going to pretend that this isn't already WAY over my head, but here's my two cents.

Originally posted by nerd4hire
When Kendra was called there was no other living slayer. When Faith was called, there was another slayer in existence at the same time. This causes a kind of short circuit, which ends the slayer line. Enter the First. It can now capitalize on the corruption in the slayer line.
Click to expand...

Buffy died and there was no slayer for good. Kendra was called, her power's used to fight evil. But Buffy was brought back to life. Giving the slayer line two champions. When Kendra died, this could be were the line started to mess up. The slayer line already had a Champion (Buffy) it was never meant to have more than one. So, maybe Faith's power's where ruited more firmly in evil. To keep the balance between good and evil they needed a good slayer and a bad slayer. That could certainly explain Faith's problem with her power's and her trying so hard to be good, maybe she was never ment to be.

So, that's what makes Buffy THE Slayer. She was the last slayer called to fight for the side of good.

I can already hear you saying 'but what about the spell in Chosen?' That called forth a lot of Slayer's and none of them, from what we saw, had a knack for being evil. But if you think about it, they weren't called in the traditionally way. A spell brought forth their powers, basically giving the Slayer Line no choice to balance the powers.

Basically, I'm just nicking nerd4hire's theory and passing it off as my own...lol... 🙂
 
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