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Spikes soul

Joan the Vampire Slayer

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"Spike's quest was, and ALWAYS WAS, to get his soul restored for Buffy, despite any misleading leaks we may have put out that you fell for."- David Fury (Btvs Writer)

What are everyone’s thoughts on this quote? Do you believe that Spike got a soul for Buffy? If not, why did he get it? What do you think he meant when he said he’d “give her what she deserves”?

Discuss.
 

Stake fodder

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I do think Spike got his soul for Buffy. I think it's very clear that he had no independent interest in acquiring a soul, only that he thought he needed one for Buffy to accept him as a lover.

However, I think the quote is not about who Spike was getting his soul for, but about the deliberate misleads that made it seem that he was seeking instead to have his chip removed. Those misleads include lines about "gonna give her what she deserves." I don't think those worked very well for two reasons. One, Spike knew he could already hurt Buffy with his chip intact. It could be argued that he wanted it removed to be able to kill anyone, something that would affect Buffy indirectly, but that seems a little too remote to justify "giving her what she deserves." So that version doesn't really make sense.

Secondly, once we know he wanted his soul, the angry tone in which he said "give her what she deserves," sometimes using stronger language, comes off as false, considering that he was doing it out of his sense of love for her. So it doesn't make sense in hindsight, either.
 

Dora

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First Spike has no soul, (A) because he is a demon, and (B) he is not dead so the only soul people talk about must be Williams, to take a soul from heaven and stuff it in a dead body with a demon that actually killed him is probably worse than what was done to Buffy
Secondly if Spike really wanted a soul for Buffy why not ask Willow at anytime previous to trying to rape Buffy she had restored Angels soul when she was a young witch let alone the megger which she was in Season 6
Thirdly Spike never ask the Demon for his soul ,restoring a soul for Buffy is not mentioned, Spike final lines in S6 are make me the man I was, he was never a souled vampire, the demon tricked him instead of removing his Chip he gave him a soul
Fourth Spike was playing Buffy when he told her he got the soul for her, that way he would stay around and have a good possibility he could get back into her pants
Fifth Whedon put this out about Spike got his soul for Buffy for Spuffy he even changed the conversation in the church from what was previously written to include Spike saying he got his soul for Buffy, so Spuffy could carry on though out S7, for instants things like Buffy being chucked out of her house, was just so Spike could ride back in on his white charger, smite the evil Faith and recue Buffy and restore her confidence to kill the evil Caleb
So if anything Spike got his soul for Spuffy not for Buffy
 

thetopher

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Um, yeah, I don't give a fig what David Fury says about Spike's motive. What's on the screen is what matters. What we, the viewer, can glean from the stories we invest in is what matters.

As it happens I think Spike absolutely went to get a soul because of Buffy, not for Buffy; there is a distinction there. I don't think it was a noble quest for love but a desperate gamble to force Buffy to admit the feelings Spike 'knew' she had but dare not speak of.

I also think Spike had little idea of the monumental change that he would undergo; that the demon, in essence, would be being destroyed by the presence of a soul and he would change utterly
(That this didn't happen is more to do with the construct that is Spike's persona and the core weaknesses of William's character but I digress)

But I also believe somebody has every right to go 'nah, he went there to get a chip out and that's it, the soul-thing is like a cosmic joke at Spike's expense' because if you have to resort to outside verification to back up your view then that goes to a failure in writing at the source.
I mean, the soul quest thing pretty much comes out of nowhere; the very idea is not set-up or established at all, so many have every right to be skeptical about it. But we must make allowances for S6 writing I guess.

Joss is a 'death of the author' kind of guy when it comes to what he writes and so that should apply here as well. Because if we only rely on what writers state rather than on augmentation and discussion we have then many questions are over, answered, no debate or discussion needed.
Hell, why even have a fandom in the first, why a discussion board? Just post up the views of the writers so you can refer to 'the truth' as and when its needed. Didn't enjoy the end S6 twist? Well then please refer to comments by Joss stating that it was a clever plot twist that subverted your expectations. Now go like it because Joss said so...
 
Joan the Vampire Slayer
Joan the Vampire Slayer
So you think his motive is open to interpretation? Interesting.

AstridDante

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He says the answer himself in S7 - Sleeper “the soul I got on my own…for you”. In another episode Get It Done I think “I did this for you. The soul the changes it’s what you wanted”. In Beneath You Buffy asks why he did it he says “to be the kind of man who never…” ie try to assault or rape her. He also says he did it “to be hers, to be loved”. In Seeing Red he says he “can’t be a monster, can’t be a man. He’s nothing” echoing Buffy’s comments to him in Smashed that he doesn’t fit in. In short he had a multitude of motivations for going to get his soul. The primary motivator is to be worthy of somebody Buffy could love. He felt that this was the missing barrier in Buffy letting herself love him. Secondly so he wouldn’t hurt her like he did in SR. He also got it because he was stuck in no man’s land between being a monster and a man and he had to make a choice. I don’t think he went to get it for the greater good or to be a good person per se. Also I think he was annoyed that his love for Buffy had drove him to these lengths.
 
Joan the Vampire Slayer
Joan the Vampire Slayer
I agree completely with all of this!

Dora

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He says the answer himself in S7 - Sleeper “the soul I got on my own…for you”. In another episode Get It Done I think “I did this for you. The soul the changes it’s what you wanted”. In Beneath You Buffy asks why he did it he says “to be the kind of man who never…” ie try to assault or rape her. He also says he did it “to be hers, to be loved”. In Seeing Red he says he “can’t be a monster, can’t be a man. He’s nothing” echoing Buffy’s comments to him in Smashed that he doesn’t fit in. In short he had a multitude of motivations for going to get his soul. The primary motivator is to be worthy of somebody Buffy could love. He felt that this was the missing barrier in Buffy letting herself love him. Secondly so he wouldn’t hurt her like he did in SR. He also got it because he was stuck in no man’s land between being a monster and a man and he had to make a choice. I don’t think he went to get it for the greater good or to be a good person per se. Also I think he was annoyed that his love for Buffy had drove him to these lengths.
If there was any motivation for Spike went to get a soul, which is not shown, he went to get it for himself not Buffy Buffy never asked him to get a soul for her
As I have pointed out many times he knew a mega witch who at anytime could have restored a soul, if he really cared what Buffy wanted there was no need to go to Africa , but then he didn't care about Buffy or her feelings this is plainly shown when he went hunting once he thought his chip had stopped working
Spike was very good at manipulating people we saw this in the Yoko factor and then manipulating a mentally ill Buffy into sex, but after trying to rape of a injured Buffy that was not going to work any more. Once the demon gave Spike a soul, he could use it against Buffy use it for sympathy hence, the soul I got for you, I did this for you , to be yous ,to be loved, all playing on Buffy's self consciousness, she had used him for self harming
With Angel /Angelus there were two distinct beings, with the soul Angel being dominant , with Spike this was not the case, the demon being dominant he was still called Spike, acted as Spike was Spike the demon
 

AstridDante

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I don’t think it was a selfless act. He realised he hurt Buffy. His actions in SR highlights to him that he is not even near worthy of her. He went to give her what she deserved. I think he didn’t go to get a soul prior to this as he honestly didn’t think he needed it. He thought he was good enough and if Buffy just got over worrying what other people think and accepted her love for him, they could be happy.
 
Skeletor Rigby
Skeletor Rigby
That's exactly it imo - he didn't think he needed it - SR rips what I call the demon-filter off - not for good obvs, not yet, but just long enough for him to get hit w reality which triggers his journey & he wrestles w his demon the whole way.
Joan the Vampire Slayer
Joan the Vampire Slayer
I agree, and he realized he NEEDED it only after what happened in SR.

Nothing13

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However, I think the quote is not about who Spike was getting his soul for, but about the deliberate misleads that made it seem that he was seeking instead to have his chip removed.
I agree, this was the point. Anyway, I think that these kinds of deceiving in writings are synonymous of bad writing sincerely.
Personally, I think that writers should always try to be coherent and consistent in relation to writing, they shouldn't voluntarily try to deceive the audience in order to manipulate them. However, Buffy as a tv show wasn't very consistent in general and I think that the main objective of writers was also deliberately ambiguous in order to make shippers and fans continuously talk about it (because it was useful for them in relation to ratings)

Anyway, I think that it is important to understand the way writers reasoned in relation to the construction of seasons and the story they wanted to represent in particular in relation to the soul and Spuffy (despite the "fanboyism" of some people with Spike and Spuffy on one side and all the frustrations other people have against Spike and Spuffy on the other side)

1) Structure of seasons
Since Spike had become the main male character because of his popularity (substituting Angel) because Riley was a "flop" in terms of appeal for the audience. Writers decided to create a story (Spuffy) that was similar but opposite to seasons 2-3 of Angel (Bangel) in relation also to the opposition (Angel/Spike)
Season 6-7 of Spuffy are a reversal of Season 2-3 of Bangel. As a matter of fact Season 6-7 represent both season 2-3:

Season 6

  1. Season 2 Angel turned Angelus, abused and stalked Buffy and she beat and killed him, Season 6 Spike (without a soul) and Buffy abused each other, and Spike (without a soul) tried to rape Buffy.
  2. Season 3 Bangel relationship wasn't the central theme of the season; Season 6-Spuffy wasn't the central theme of the season and both male characters went away from the city
Season 7
  1. In Season 3, Angel returns "crazy" to Sunnydale from a Hell dimension and Buffy must help him, but she doesn't know how to relate to him in relation to their story.
  2. In Season 7 Spike returns "crazy" to Sunnydale because of the soul and Buffy must help him, but she doesn't know how to relate to him in relation to their story.
  3. Season 2 was the Bangel season and Season 7 was the Spuffy season
  4. The final moment Buffy-Spike in Chosen is the culmination of their relationship of Season 7, as the final moment, Buffy-Angel in Becoming Part 2 is the culmination of their relationship in Season 2. Both Angel and Spike dies in relation to Buffy, but in a reversed way:
    • Angel died closing the Mouth of Achatla (the Mouth of Hell) and went to Hell
    • Spike died closing the Hellmouth of Sunnydale and got divinized/sanctified
"Spike's quest was, and ALWAYS WAS, to get his soul restored for Buffy, despite any misleading leaks we may have put out that you fell for."- David Fury (Btvs Writer)
So, yes, Spike's quest was to get his soul restored for Buffy and writers knew what they were doing:
  • Angel lost his soul because of Buffy (in a moment of pure happiness)
  • Spike gained his soul because of Buffy (for selfish reasons)
2) Angel
Writers connected it also to the evolution of Angel as a character
Angel lost everything he loved also in relation to the curse of gypsies:
  • Buffy
  • Darla
  • Connor
  • Cordelia
In detail:
  1. Buffy was Angel's soulmate and their relationship was a "forever love" relationship
  2. Darla was Angel'sire, he returned to life as a human with the possibility of redemption and become the mother of his son Connor
  3. Connor was his son
  4. Cordelia was the woman that always assisted him for many years after falling in love and the 2 established a mature and adult relationship with the possibility of raising Connor as a family Father-Mother-Son
He lost these things in relation to Drusilla, Holtz, and Spike as a sort of karmic punishment in relation to the curse of having a soul and the change of the personality of Angelus/Angel

Drusilla
In past:
Angelus (and Darla) killed Drusilla's family tortured her physically and mentally and after he sired her.
In present: Drusilla sired the new-human Darla with Angel watching (this is a reversion of Angelus siring Drusilla and Darla watching).

Holtz
In past:
Angelus and Darla killed Holtz family, his wife, and his children
In present: Holtz returned, tooke away Angel's son from him, and raised like he was his son.
Angel was punished losing Darla (his woman) that died and his son Connor. Differently, Holtz had the possibility to rise Connor as his son replacing his dead children.

The same happened to Cordelia and Connor and the mess of Season 4 of Angel ruining the possibility of Angel creating a family with Cordelia and Connor as he dreamed (Like he ruined the families of others in particular of Holtz)
In the end, Connor was raised by another family, not by Angel.

Spike
Since Buffy and Drusilla are symbolically related:
  • both are saints as humans
  • both have visions
  • Drusilla and Buffy's birthdays are on the same date: January 19.
These 2 women are interchanged by Angel and Spike:

Season 2: At the beginning of Season 2 Spike was the "Big Bad" with his girlfriend Drusilla, but after he got injured and handicapped in a wheelchair, Angel turned Angelus.
Angelus supplanted Spike's role as "Big Bad" stealing also his girlfriend Drusilla.
In season 2 Angel, normally the "Good Vampire" died as a Villain/Big Bad

Season 7: Spike (now in a relationship with Buffy) took the role of Angel. He was another vampire with a soul prophesized for his main role in the Apocalypse.
Angel should had use the amulet to destroy the First Evil's army and stay with Buffy; however, fate twisted and Spike took his role and Buffy chose him (as a sort of karmic punishment)
In season 7 Spike, normally the "Bad Vampire" died as a Hero with Buffy
Spike took away Angel's Destiny as Angelus took away "his destiny" Drusilla.
As Angelus took away Spike's role of Villain and his girlfriend Drusilla in Season 2 after Angel lost his soul (in relation to Buffy); in Season 7 Spike took away Angel's role of Hero and his "girlfriend" Buffy after Spike gained his soul (in relation to Buffy)
 
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ILLYRIAN

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That quote by the screenplay writer David Fury is wrong, for starters that the in brackets part appears to announce he is viewed as the singular writer of BTVS - he wasn't. There were several scriptwriters for the series plus as has been stated many times Joss Whedon had the final say on what the script would be.
But about Spike getting a soul, did he get it for him so he could be the best form of himself for her?
 
Joan the Vampire Slayer
Joan the Vampire Slayer
Yes, I think he did.

Btvs fan

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"Spike's quest was, and ALWAYS WAS, to get his soul restored for Buffy, despite any misleading leaks we may have put out that you fell for."- David Fury (Btvs Writer)

What are everyone’s thoughts on this quote? Do you believe that Spike got a soul for Buffy? If not, why did he get it? What do you think he meant when he said he’d “give her what she deserves”?

Discuss.

James Marsters has said he was led to believe that Spike was getting his chip out otherwise he would have played it differently.

You can see a different variation in his saying the lines in Grave when, it's clear he knows that Spike is getting his soul.

Another reason for the soul of course is that after the AR you cant have the character running around. Buffy would have to kill him. Now he's an incredibly popular character. There's a reason he was moved over to Ats to save that show from cancellation . They weren't just going to kill him off.
 
Joan the Vampire Slayer
Joan the Vampire Slayer
Interesting about what JM said. I didn't know that.

Dora

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I don’t think it was a selfless act. He realised he hurt Buffy. His actions in SR highlights to him that he is not even near worthy of her. He went to give her what she deserved. I think he didn’t go to get a soul prior to this as he honestly didn’t think he needed it. He thought he was good enough and if Buffy just got over worrying what other people think and accepted her love for him, they could be happy.
Ignoring Willow being able to give Spike a soul .If he really thought Buffy would like him to have a soul?, We go straight back to Spike going hunting in S6 when he thought his chip had stopped working, how doe's this correspond with him, what part of loving the slayer means you feed on humans, how would that survive a long term relationship?.
Should the bathroom scene and Buffy fighting him off had happened earlier, Spike said I didn't Buffy replied because I stopped you something I should have done long ago, indicating Buffy was not happy with how she was being treated by Spike, we see this in the Balcony scene when Spike never got permission said stop me, he rap, Spike got no permission in the bathroom but fortunately for Buffy even injured she was able to physically and mentally fight him off, before she was easy to manipulate because of her depression, fighting off Spike shows signs she was on the mend . As I posted Spike went to the Demon to get the chip out , got a soul instead, then Whedon changed it for Spuffy , if he had not how would Spike been such a central Character in Season 7 how would he have Buffy confidence.
 

Dora

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That quote by the screenplay writer David Fury is wrong, for starters that the in brackets part appears to announce he is viewed as the singular writer of BTVS - he wasn't. There were several scriptwriters for the series plus as has been stated many times Joss Whedon had the final say on what the script would be.
But about Spike getting a soul, did he get it for him so he could be the best form of himself for her?
Spike getting a soul ? Spikes last line in S6 make me the man I was Spike was never a souled vampire he meant remove the chip
 
Joan the Vampire Slayer
Joan the Vampire Slayer
Agree to disagree, friend!

katmobile

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James Marsters has said he was led to believe that Spike was getting his chip out otherwise he would have played it differently.

You can see a different variation in his saying the lines in Grave when, it's clear he knows that Spike is getting his soul.

Another reason for the soul of course is that after the AR you cant have the character running around. Buffy would have to kill him. Now he's an incredibly popular character. There's a reason he was moved over to Ats to save that show from cancellation . They weren't just going to kill him off.
That's why I hate that they did that. Had they told James the truth but told him to play it so that the soul was what Spike was after but with enough ambiguity so that the twist would work he'd have done that. He's a damn fine actor and a smart cookie he could have done that.
Post automatically merged:

Ignoring Willow being able to give Spike a soul .If he really thought Buffy would like him to have a soul?, We go straight back to Spike going hunting in S6 when he thought his chip had stopped working, how doe's this correspond with him, what part of loving the slayer means you feed on humans, how would that survive a long term relationship?.
Should the bathroom scene and Buffy fighting him off had happened earlier, Spike said I didn't Buffy replied because I stopped you something I should have done long ago, indicating Buffy was not happy with how she was being treated by Spike, we see this in the Balcony scene when Spike never got permission said stop me, he rap, Spike got no permission in the bathroom but fortunately for Buffy even injured she was able to physically and mentally fight him off, before she was easy to manipulate because of her depression, fighting off Spike shows signs she was on the mend . As I posted Spike went to the Demon to get the chip out , got a soul instead, then Whedon changed it for Spuffy , if he had not how would Spike been such a central Character in Season 7 how would he have Buffy confidence.
Ok - listen carefully. Willow even without her dealing with her own stuff - enjoying her reconcilation with Tara and then being torn apart by her death - can't do it. Willow didn't devise the spell to re-ensoul Angel she's copying the Romany's handiwork. If it worked on any old vampire don't you think they'd have used it before on Harmony, on Sunday, maybe even on Spike? The indications are that the Roma had that spell tailored for whoever killed their beloved - those words exactly probably. Otherwise they'd have ensouled Darla and Dru and Spike when they stormed into their camp. The wording was specific which is why Angel lost his soul when he was perfectly happy.
 
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Joan the Vampire Slayer
Joan the Vampire Slayer
I agree - I don't think Willow could have reensouled Spike even if she wanted to.

thetopher

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Sineya
He says the answer himself in S7 - Sleeper “the soul I got on my own…for you”. In another episode Get It Done I think “I did this for you. The soul the changes it’s what you wanted”. In Beneath You Buffy asks why he did it he says “to be the kind of man who never…” ie try to assault or rape her. He also says he did it “to be hers, to be loved”.

But an uncharitable person doesn't have to see that as any kind of proof, its just Spike's word after the fact.
There are many reasons- at this point- for Spike to be wrong in his assertions; he could be lying, he could be deluding himself, convincing himself that yes, he did go for a soul after all. Maybe he would just be misremembering, conflating one desire with another.

Remember that this is (in theory) a very different Spike, the very presence of a soul could skew any and all his memories in a significant manner. He's wrestling with some fundamental questions about his identity and sense of self, dealing with the weight of over a century of violence and brutality that he inflicted.
Add to that the fact that he never had the most grounded view of reality (or himself) to begin with and its easy to see him claiming something that wasn't actually true in the first place.
Whether its a conscious decision to do that is another matter.


Personally, while I absolutely believe Spike when he tells these things to Buffy (over and over) I don't find it sympathetic at all. It's obnoxious to dump all your emotional baggage on somebody else and make it their responsibility.

Secondly so he wouldn’t hurt her like he did in SR.

Sadly, given his motivation, I really don't think this was possible.
 

Antho

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Ok - listen carefully. Willow even without her dealing with her own stuff - enjoying her reconcilation with Tara and then being torn apart by her death - can't do it. Willow didn't devise the spell to re-ensoul Angel she's copying the Romany's handiwork. If it worked on any old vampire don't you think they'd have used it before on Harmony, on Sunday, maybe even on Spike? The indications are that the Roma had that spell tailored for whoever killed their beloved - those words exactly probably. Otherwise they'd have ensouled Darla and Dru and Spike when they stormed into their camp. The wording was specific which is why Angel lost his soul when he was perfectly happy.
Yes but by the level of Magic Willow does have in season 6 she sure should be able to restore Spike’s soul by herself. If she can bring back Buffy to life, I seriously doubt there is lot of things she doesn’t have the level of magics to do.
 
Joan the Vampire Slayer
Joan the Vampire Slayer
Chalk it up to bad writing, I guess!

nightshade

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"Spike's quest was, and ALWAYS WAS, to get his soul restored for Buffy, despite any misleading leaks we may have put out that you fell for."- David Fury (Btvs Writer)

What are everyone’s thoughts on this quote? Do you believe that Spike got a soul for Buffy? If not, why did he get it? What do you think he meant when he said he’d “give her what she deserves”?
Yes, he was completely selfish in it, he got it as he believed that it was what she wanted, what Buffy actually wanted was of no concern to him.
 
Joan the Vampire Slayer
Joan the Vampire Slayer
It was out of desperation I think - he was obsessed with making her love him back.

Nothing13

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Yes but by the level of Magic Willow does have in season 6 she sure should be able to restore Spike’s soul by herself. If she can bring back Buffy to life, I seriously doubt there is lot of things she doesn’t have the level of magics to do.
In season 4 of Angel (that was almost a year after season 6 of Buffy) she couldn't restore the soul of Angel normally without the curse of Gypsies, otherwise, she should have done it.
She still copied the spell of gypsies, like in season 2 of Buffy, cursing Angel another time. She didn't give him a soul outside the curse (substantially freeing Angel from the curse with a permanent soul). So if she wasn't able to do it for Angel, she shouldn't be able to do it to Spike.

Anyway writers always cared more about metaphors in their writing, the logical representation of the story was always secondary for them
They had objectives for the story with seasons 6-7 and it was also interlinking the relationships of characters so they should follow a particular structure for the story they wanted to narrate (despite fans liking/disliking, agree/don't agree with the narrative choices or deluding themselves without understanding the point of the writers):
The main couple Buffy and Spike with:
  1. Xander-Anya
  2. Willow-Tara
  3. Faith-Robin Wood
Buffy and Spike relationship during seasons 6-7 should follow the relationships of the other characters in terms of best/worst moments and positive/negative aspects of relationships:
1) Xander-Anya
-In season 6 both Xander and Buffy broke up the relationship with Anya and Spike, Anya and Spike were emotionally destroyed and comfort each other "cheating" on Xander/Buffy. Xander and Buffy instead of being indifferent, were hurt by this event.
-In season 7 Xander/Anya and Buffy/Spike tried to resume their relationship but it ended with Spike and Anya dying in Chosen.

2) Willow-Tara
-In season 6 Spike/Buffy's relationship based on sex addiction was symbolically linked to Willow's addiction to magic. This addiction was bad for Buffy and Spike and also ruined Willow's persona and her relationship with Tara. The culmination of these problematic relationships was in the episode "Seeing Red" where Tara got killed and Willow turned Dark Willow because of her magic addiction, and Spike trieed to rape Buffy.
-In season 7 Willow trieed to restart her activity with magic but she was afraid of it like Buffy and Spike were afraid of their relationship, however, all characters during the season overcomed these problems and reach the next stage: the "divine level":
  • Willow in Chosen got "divinized" in her relationship with Magic
  • Spike in Chosen got "divinized" in his relationship with Buffy
  • hqdefault.jpg
  • Chosen-spike-22270935-400-249.jpg
From the worst in Seeing Red (Dark Willow and Spike's attempt rape) to the best in Chosen (the divinization of Willow and Spike in their relationships with Magic and Buffy)

3) Faith-Robin Wood

Both Spike and Robin had a problem with their mothers because of trauma during their past years. Robin Wood searched a girlfriend like his mother (Nikki a Slayer) because of psychological problems like Spike's search for a girlfriend like his mother Anne.
Robin dated, in the beginning, Buffy, and after Faith, 2 Slayers, because subconsciously they remind him of his mother Nikki, a Slayer. Spike was subconsciously attracted by Buffy because she remained his mother Anne.
Spike's women in his life/unlife are symbolically related (Anne-Drusilla-Buffy):
  • Drusilla and Buffy's birthdays are on the same date: January 19
  • Spike mother's name Anne is the same as Buffy's second name: Buffy Anne Summers
Faith replaces and compensates Nikki to Robin like Buffy Anne Summers replaces Anne to Spike in terms of emotional need.
At the end of Season 7, Spike-Anya-Tara (the lovers of the main characters) died or are died and Robin Wood almost died.
So, if writers decided to follow a particular structure for characters and characters' relationships during the seasons, I think that there was also a limitation in the situations they could develop in terms of the "possibilities of the story/situations" they could create in seasons because they should always have to interconnect the story of Buffy-Willow-Xander (the 3 main characters)
 

Dora

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In season 4 of Angel (that was almost a year after season 6 of Buffy) she couldn't restore the soul of Angel normally without the curse of Gypsies, otherwise, she should have done it.
She still copied the spell of gypsies, like in season 2 of Buffy, cursing Angel another time. She didn't give him a soul outside the curse (substantially freeing Angel from the curse with a permanent soul). So if she wasn't able to do it for Angel, she shouldn't be able to do it to Spike.

Anyway writers always cared more about metaphors in their writing, the logical representation of the story was always secondary for them
They had objectives for the story with seasons 6-7 and it was also interlinking the relationships of characters so they should follow a particular structure for the story they wanted to narrate (despite fans liking/disliking, agree/don't agree with the narrative choices or deluding themselves without understanding the point of the writers):

So, if writers decided to follow a particular structure for characters and characters' relationships during the seasons, I think that there was also a limitation in the situations they could develop in terms of the "possibilities of the story/situations" they could create in seasons because they should always have to interconnect the story of Buffy-Willow-Xander (the 3 main characters)
Its incidental if Willow could or not return a soul to Spike the fact is Spike did not care enough about Buffy to ask
 

katmobile

Scooby
Joined
Jun 17, 2018
Messages
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Age
50
Its incidental if Willow could or not return a soul to Spike the fact is Spike did not care enough about Buffy to ask
And the goal posts move at will. He couldn't exactly approach Willow when she was living in Buffy's house without Buffy being aware of it and also maybe he had an inkling that was the case.
 
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