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Was Angel and gang joining Wolfram & Hart the plan all along?

Mr Trick

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Am rewatching and am on S2. One line which stood out to me was Holland saying that Angel is part of the plan and Wolfram's big picture. Because throughout the series they keep deciding that its best to keep Angel around it makes me wonder if the showrunners always intended to have Angel run the firm in a later season? So was it planned or just something they decided later on?
 

Plasma

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Black Thorn
I don’t believe so

The understanding that I get from S2 is that W&H wanted Angel to be bad, but also to give up hope in his mission. When he takes the elevator and realizes (or is tricked into thinking) that Earth is the home office, Holland really tries to push the idea that Angel will never win because of human nature.

They wanted him bad so he would push away or eliminate elements that worked against W&H, while simultaneously trying to demoralize him in his mission. Him joining was definitely not a part of the plan initially.

As far as the showrunners? Doubtful. They couldn’t have planned for Charisma to leave, and Cordelia being the moral compass of the group since Season 1 is something that would have made joining W&H impossible. They simply reached a point where the characters were able to be guided due to moral complications and grey areas like they couldn’t have before. That combined with it being their last season likely pushed them to do something final and conclusive with the storyline.
 
Mr Trick
Mr Trick
Interesting point about Cordy never thought about it that way.

AlphaFoxtrot

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I don't recall reading or hearing anything that would suggest that, either way. It's pretty clear by season 4 they really don't know what to do with W&,H, it's just a source for mystical information. And Season 1-4 WR&H is a very different place than Season 5.
 

Btvs fan

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Am rewatching and am on S2. One line which stood out to me was Holland saying that Angel is part of the plan and Wolfram's big picture. Because throughout the series they keep deciding that its best to keep Angel around it makes me wonder if the showrunners always intended to have Angel run the firm in a later season? So was it planned or just something they decided later on?
Doubtful, you've got Greenwalt and Minear with there own different directions and agendas as well Whedon with his own. Everything was very on the fly. Hell they weren't even sure they were getting a season 5 until very late in the day.
 

Mr Trick

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That's true. I guess my thinking was that maybe they were planting a seed early in the show for something which was going to come later, but with all the changes in creative and the future up in the air I can see how maybe there was never really a clear long term plan.
 

Cohen

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Sineya
That combined with it being their last season likely pushed them to do something final and conclusive with the storyline.
Just me being nit picky but they didn’t know it would be the last season until they were filming the final 6-7 episodes. It was canceled rather unexpectedly.

I don't recall reading or hearing anything that would suggest that, either way. It's pretty clear by season 4 they really don't know what to do with W&,H, it's just a source for mystical information. And Season 1-4 WR&H is a very different place than Season 5.
Yes I always found it odd that they built a set completely different than the W&H from the first 4 seasons. I mean i know it needed to be different because they were setting up AI there but it makes the season all completely different.
 

AlphaFoxtrot

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Re: The Set; That I do know. One of the terms of a Fifth season by the Network was to not be so dark and brooding. That's why the modern office building was used.
 

Cohen

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Re: The Set; That I do know. One of the terms of a Fifth season by the Network was to not be so dark and brooding. That's why the modern office building was used.
Gross. I hate network interference. I know they required James to come over to Angel in an effort to bring in more Buddy (edit: Buffy) viewers. Network interference is generally the cause of crappy story decisions. It’s why Charmed didn’t get to leave the studio lot in its final season, and it looked so cheaply produced. 😩


@Plasma Curse autocorrect!! I have to rewrite Buffy like 8 times before it lets me keep it! 😅😅
 
Plasma
Plasma
My favorite show: Buddy the Demon Killer ;)
T
thrasherpix
I've noticed some of the best stuff comes without suits over it. Once it gets big, then they get involved, ruin it, blame society than themselves. I Love Lucy was a time they got comeuppance. Some film & actor schools suck ('cause results)

ILLYRIAN

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Sounds like what was said was bad Manners by Holland to tell that to Angel.
 
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