Riley lights up Season 4

telperion66

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Now, as many of you know, my favourite Buffy season is the first one, followed by the second and then the third. I care little for the later seasons on re-watch.

However, just dipping into season four of late, I am struck by how Riley truly lights up the season.

Clearly, the season has a much "brighter" overall feel and look to the preceding seasons, and while this may not totally be a positive, in Riley's case it really is.

He shines bright in the early parts of the season and in my opinion is a big plus point for what was the new Buffy "dynamic" of season four.

What are your opinions of how Riley fits in, and how he contributes to season four, and the latter seasons until his departure?

What impact do you think he had?
 
Joan the Vampire Slayer
Joan the Vampire Slayer
I like Riley early on and agree that his presence in Buffy's life is positive...until it isn't, of course.
I can see that. Season 4 is, if you look at it, something of a resting period for the series, which to be fair, is how Freshman year of college turns out, and college in general for that matter.
 
He brings the 'All American Boy' into the mix, making collage look like the ideal place to go after the hell of high school. Its the shiney happy honeymoon period of infatuation that Buffy didn't really get with Angel. Riley later shows how the reality of the world he lives in corrupts even the prettiest of perfect people.
 
I think one of the problems with Riley is that he gets outshone by Spike and Angel in every scene he shares with them, and given that the three of them are Buffy's main love interests throughout the series, naturally Riley always comes in last in fans' opinion. Given that being Buffy's "normal" boyfriend is his main role in the series, he's basically already at a disadvantage.

At the beginning of Season 4, he does genuinely seem like a nice guy, especially in the scene where Buffy knocks the books on his head, but making him the leader of an elite military force kind of pushes the suspension of disbelief to its limit if its given any real thought. In fact the whole initiative storyline suffers from this.

However, the real issue with Riley for me is his behaviour towards Buffy. Riley is actually a bit of a jerk towards her throughout Season 5, especially in Into the Woods, which retroactively makes some of his less than stellar season 4 behaviour such as The Yoko Factor more questionable. It's kind of telling that the moment the power dynamic changes between them (Riley's no longer in charge at the initiative, no longer the TA in Buffy's class, no longer has his super soldier abilities etc), basically the moment Riley is brought down to "normal", he can't handle it, and he becomes almost obsessed with Buffy "needing" him. Given how Riley was behaving towards Buffy, her missing the helicopter was the best thing that could've happened to her. Due to Riley's ultimatum that was essentially "Give me a reason to stay or it's your fault if I leave", if Buffy had stopped Riley leaving, she would be trapping herself in the Briley relationship because she would've prevented Riley from re-joining the military therefore she "owes" him to make the relationship work even though she's not happy in it. When taking Season 5 into account, it retroactively makes Season 4 look like the "honeymoon period" for the Briley relationship. Episodes like The Yoko Factor show Riley's nice guy mask starting to slip whilst Season 5 is his true colours starting to show.

This is why I have so much issue with Xander's speech in Into the Woods. Buffy has called Riley out on his behaviour, she's refused to give into his ultimatum , she's basically stood up for herself and gone "this is me, either deal with it or go but I am not being dragged into your issues", yet Xander practically tells her that she SHOULD put up with and tolerate Riley's unacceptable behaviour because he is "the one that comes along once in a life time" and Buffy listens and believes him. What was an empowering moment for Buffy (and arguably women everywhere who have been in a relationship where their partner is trying to make themselves indispensable) is essentially kicked aside for "you should totally be with this guy and change for him because he can't accept you for who you are". It's an awful message to send to the audience.

Had the writers actually "gone there" with the Briley relationship, and shown how easily it is to get sucked in without even realising it, then I think Riley could've been a really powerful character to have on the show because he had everyone fooled, including the audience, with his nice guy act. His less than stellar moments seemed OOC which is why he's so easily forgiven but that is actually the real Riley.

In some ways I view Briley as worse than Spuffy. Whilst Spuffy is awful and unhealthy for both participants, at least it is honest about it and Buffy KNOWS it's not a good thing even though she chooses to continue engaging in it. However, with Briley, Buffy kind of sleepwalks into it without realising and it's only because Spike showed Buffy what Riley was up to (because of his own selfish reasons) that Buffy called Riley out on his behaviour. Even then, Riley is trying to blame her for it, saying he wanted to "even the score" because Buffy "let" Dracula bite (despite her making it clear it was against her will), he then talks about how the vampire whores made him feel "needed", something which buffy doesn't do- again blaming her for his behaviour.

Season 6 Buffy would be Riley's perfect Buffy because she is an absolute wreck that season and that vulnerability would enable him to manoeuvre himself into a position where Buffy becomes dependant on him. Riley could've been the real villain of Season 6 and Tara could've been the ones to spot the signs that something wasn't right within the Briley relationship due to her background with her family. Buffy rising out of her state of despair would be paired with her kicking Riley to the kerb as he would've wanted to keep her in that depressed state because it benefitted him to do so.
 
DeepBlueJoy
DeepBlueJoy
Riley is evil as order
I liked him for his dry sense of humor and being unusually nice. Maybe it was just so different. I excused his bad behavior in the last part of the season because of drug withdrawals and general trauma.

The Briley was kind of ruined for me because it just felt to me like Buffy thought she had to be with a man or there was something wrong with her, and it was even like she was trying to create excuses not to be with him (I liked how Willow mocked her with "run while you still can" as Buffy describes him as perfect but she doesn't feel right without the pain). So it was like she was with him because she was obligated to. I don't think it was the intent of the writing but it's just how it felt to me. Some of Riley's lines to Buffy don't help, though I loved the two of them in Hush (hmm, so maybe if Riley just shut up it would've been better... 😛 )

But I still liked him as a character.
 
Riley as the 'normal joe' boyfriend is completely diminished by the fact that he's a highly trained soldier who was experimented on by a mad scientist to hunt down demons. I think Riley had potential because he genuinely is kind of alright in the first few episodes of Season 4, but as soon as his secret is out, he drops down a peg or twelve. He's just a bit bland in the rest of Season 4, before becoming unbearable (personal take) in the next season.
 
I don’t like Riley’s character and I don’t think Angel, Riley, or Spike were Buffy’s match. With that said I appreciate Season 4 and Riley for the fact that it wasn’t all doom and gloom. He was a nice break in between Angel and Spike and Season 4 was a nice break between how dark Season 3 was and how heavy Season 5 is.
 
He gives off a sort of Malcolm Reynolds vibe with some of his lines. I mean, I hear him say the lines and they just sound like something Mal would say.
 
I love Riley! I really enjoyed season 4 a lot because of him and it had hurt when he had left, especially when he had thought she had let him go. Sorry but I think the show had gone downhill hill after that. It was all doom and misery, especially in season 6. When Riley came back i had realised just how much I had missed the character. Buffy was happy with him longer than she had with Angel or Spike, he had given her a sense of normalcy and that's beautiful. People have asked who Buffy loves more, Angel or Spike but the question should have been Angel or Riley( although I'm pretty sure it's angel as well) because she loved Riley more than Spike.
 
Buffy may not have loved Riley as much as Angel but she definitely loved him more than Spike.
 
I think one of the problems with Riley is that he gets outshone by Spike and Angel in every scene he shares with them, and given that the three of them are Buffy's main love interests throughout the series, naturally Riley always comes in last in fans' opinion. Given that being Buffy's "normal" boyfriend is his main role in the series, he's basically already at a disadvantage.

At the beginning of Season 4, he does genuinely seem like a nice guy, especially in the scene where Buffy knocks the books on his head, but making him the leader of an elite military force kind of pushes the suspension of disbelief to its limit if its given any real thought. In fact the whole initiative storyline suffers from this.

However, the real issue with Riley for me is his behaviour towards Buffy. Riley is actually a bit of a jerk towards her throughout Season 5, especially in Into the Woods, which retroactively makes some of his less than stellar season 4 behaviour such as The Yoko Factor more questionable. It's kind of telling that the moment the power dynamic changes between them (Riley's no longer in charge at the initiative, no longer the TA in Buffy's class, no longer has his super soldier abilities etc), basically the moment Riley is brought down to "normal", he can't handle it, and he becomes almost obsessed with Buffy "needing" him. Given how Riley was behaving towards Buffy, her missing the helicopter was the best thing that could've happened to her. Due to Riley's ultimatum that was essentially "Give me a reason to stay or it's your fault if I leave", if Buffy had stopped Riley leaving, she would be trapping herself in the Briley relationship because she would've prevented Riley from re-joining the military therefore she "owes" him to make the relationship work even though she's not happy in it. When taking Season 5 into account, it retroactively makes Season 4 look like the "honeymoon period" for the Briley relationship. Episodes like The Yoko Factor show Riley's nice guy mask starting to slip whilst Season 5 is his true colours starting to show.

This is why I have so much issue with Xander's speech in Into the Woods. Buffy has called Riley out on his behaviour, she's refused to give into his ultimatum , she's basically stood up for herself and gone "this is me, either deal with it or go but I am not being dragged into your issues", yet Xander practically tells her that she SHOULD put up with and tolerate Riley's unacceptable behaviour because he is "the one that comes along once in a life time" and Buffy listens and believes him. What was an empowering moment for Buffy (and arguably women everywhere who have been in a relationship where their partner is trying to make themselves indispensable) is essentially kicked aside for "you should totally be with this guy and change for him because he can't accept you for who you are". It's an awful message to send to the audience.

Had the writers actually "gone there" with the Briley relationship, and shown how easily it is to get sucked in without even realising it, then I think Riley could've been a really powerful character to have on the show because he had everyone fooled, including the audience, with his nice guy act. His less than stellar moments seemed OOC which is why he's so easily forgiven but that is actually the real Riley.

In some ways I view Briley as worse than Spuffy. Whilst Spuffy is awful and unhealthy for both participants, at least it is honest about it and Buffy KNOWS it's not a good thing even though she chooses to continue engaging in it. However, with Briley, Buffy kind of sleepwalks into it without realising and it's only because Spike showed Buffy what Riley was up to (because of his own selfish reasons) that Buffy called Riley out on his behaviour. Even then, Riley is trying to blame her for it, saying he wanted to "even the score" because Buffy "let" Dracula bite (despite her making it clear it was against her will), he then talks about how the vampire whores made him feel "needed", something which buffy doesn't do- again blaming her for his behaviour.

Season 6 Buffy would be Riley's perfect Buffy because she is an absolute wreck that season and that vulnerability would enable him to manoeuvre himself into a position where Buffy becomes dependant on him. Riley could've been the real villain of Season 6 and Tara could've been the ones to spot the signs that something wasn't right within the Briley relationship due to her background with her family. Buffy rising out of her state of despair would be paired with her kicking Riley to the kerb as he would've wanted to keep her in that depressed state because it benefitted him to do so.
Disagree with you. Xander was right to say that to Buffy. Buffy was freezing Riley out, had treated him as a convenience and that's not OK. if it was the other way around, if Riley was the one who was connecting to everyone but her and had only thought about her when climbing into bed to feel good, fans would be defending her. They've both made mistakes but Buffy had needed to understand that she had to be present in a adult relationship. If she didn't feel the same way about Riley then the kind thing to do would be to let him go but if she did and she's done letting her issues get in the way then she should try and stop him from leaving and she did. She ran like her life depended on it. She had obviously loved him and the break up was hard for her. Xander cares about her, saw how happy she was with Riley and didn't want her to do something she'd regret. He'd just wanted her to make a decision and stick with it. Fans have the complete wrong idea about Riley. It was never about wanting Buffy to make him feel like a man, it was about wanting to feel appreciated and that your partner was in it with you. The stupid "he was threatened by her and wanted her to be helpless" theories Riley haters have couldn't make less sense. Keeping her depressed? Sounds nothing like him. That's something a desperate stalker like Spike would do to get some hot slayer sex. Buffy was depressed and spike had made it worse for her by manipulating her into thinking she came back wrong and keeping her away from her friends by saying she doesn't belong to them. It was thanks to Riley that she had the confidence to start making better decisions for herself. His understanding and empathetic nature meant that he'd help people feel better about themselves, has done it many times in the show.
 
Riley lights up the season like a greasy hobo barrel fire. Lots of stinky black smoke.

He was was lil Master Hitler Youth with none of the power of actual Hitler. Vacuous with a side of petty cruelty. Nope! Not my cuppa!

He most reminds me of dear old Ted, but without the acting chops of John Ritter.
 
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Riley lights up the season like a greasy hobo barrel fire. Lots of stinky black smoke.

He was was lil Master Hitler Youth with none of the power of actual Hitler. Vacuous with a side of petty cruelty. Nope! Not my cuppa!

He most reminds me of dear old Ted, but without the acting chops of John Ritter.

wooo. Definitely can't see that. In fact to me it's the fact that he can start to see the potential for cruelty that helps him get out of the Initiative
 
wooo. Definitely can't see that. In fact to me it's the fact that he can start to see the potential for cruelty that helps him get out of the Initiative
I agree. He did show good sense by leaving the Initiative, but this is the same guy who uses a fake stake to terrorise Spike. Anyone who would carry a faux stake has serious darkness inside. He only plays a shiny knight. If he had staked Spike for real, that i would have gotten,(though i would not have agreed with it) but the fake out was just torture - pain causing, emotional terror - that is the act of a sadist.
 
Did anyone notice that he was supposed to be a member of an elite squad and barely looked like he had seen any action? He was too young for that part. Grizzled elite squad members look like they have seen it all and when they recall to mind things they have done, they have that thousand-yard stare. He and his squad also seemed to be written like frat boys rather than a self-disciplined group of elite soldiers.

And did you notice that he seems to fail at everything we see him do, at least in Season 4? He was badly written and badly acted and that doesn't light up anything.
 
Did anyone notice that he was supposed to be a member of an elite squad and barely looked like he had seen any action? He was too young for that part. Grizzled elite squad members look like they have seen it all and when they recall to mind things they have done, they have that thousand-yard stare. He and his squad also seemed to be written like frat boys rather than a self-disciplined group of elite soldiers.

And did you notice that he seems to fail at everything we see him do, at least in Season 4? He was badly written and badly acted and that doesn't light up anything.
You can tell no one writing him had any real clue about the military or even the law of military action in the US.
 
T
thrasherpix
Actually have no clue about civilian laws and security protocols, either. The headcanon I have to come up with to explain so much of the bad in the writing...I'd say not just that which they didn't know about (and it shows).
I found Riley quite likeable to begin with but his storylines were never that engaging and his character didn’t quite fit in - nearly everyone else has an exaggerated character or plays it big whereas Riley was just so regular in every respect which made him seem quite dull in comparison, and he and Sarah never had much chemistry

But I do find it slightly surprising how little empathy he gets from a lot of people when he does go off the rails.
He loses pretty much his whole identity - his job, his extended military family, finds out that Walsh who was like a second mother to him had been lying to him, drugging him and had implanted a behaviour modifier in him, she then dies before he has a chance to deal with his feelings of betrayal, his friend Forrest is killed, he then has to kill what Forrest becomes, has to come off drugs which not only leads to physical and emotional withdrawals but also leads to him becoming much weaker which must be hard for someone whose sense of self comes from being a kind of soldier, and the one person he can confide in starts to become more distant with him (not blaming Buffy for that - she has big enough problems of her own to deal with but that doesnt make it any easier for Riley when he is losing his grip).
All in all not a great year, and unlike the Scoobies who provide a safety net for each other he is more alone. I dont agree with his later behaviour but I can understand what has pushed him to it
 
I liked Riley in Hush and seemed there was potential and his character or storyline might be going somewhere then meh. Didn't like him, boring, and the acting was a little wooden
 
As I've said elsewhere on the forum, I'm probably one of the few who likes Riley, and who liked him as a couple with Buffy.

The way the writers blew up that relationship, and the whole vamp thing was silly, in my opinion.

I will say this, it never fails to make me laugh during Buff and Riley's first encounter: "I'm nice to meet" and the look on Buffy's face when she's realised what she said is hysterical. 🤣
 
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